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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2021 9:01:15 GMT -5
I tried those two offerings. WHB in 2019 and I opened a tin of the WHG last week. I could not help being reminded of the Backwoods cigars, not only in the tin note and especially in the taste, but also in the room note. WHB reminded me of the Honey Berry variety.
Learning that Sutliff manufactures WH I did a search and found out that they also manufacture the Backwoods pipe tobaccos. It would be a logical deduction to assume they also manufacture the cigars as well.
So my question is: are WH tobaccos based on cigar leaves or are the cigars based on pipe tobacco leaves? Considering the level of quality of the Backwood cigars, I cannot help feeling cheated out on by buying pipe tobacco that is supposed to be a resurrection of a legend (made with quality leaves) but made with what seems to be low grade tobacco leaves and 'cheap' casing procedures.
To summarize: I am extremely disappointed by the mighty horse.
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Post by fadingdaylight on Jun 1, 2021 9:30:20 GMT -5
Haven't tried either of them, but I have tried the first release of STG Warhorse, and found that one enjoyable, though the slight sweet topping was never my favorite.
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Post by trailboss on Jun 1, 2021 10:24:18 GMT -5
Although you may notice a similarity to blackwoods cigars, they share no genealogy with the cigars. Dan Johnston, and Simon Thurlow started Standard tobacco, and resurrected the blend. Relying on old samples that were sent off to an Israeli lab to determine the components, Dan and Simon kept their findings confidential. They employed the help of their friend Russ Oulette, tobacco blender. Without knowing what the lab findings were and relying on his palate, he correctly named the components and Dan and Simon checked off the boxes.
From then on, they worked quite awhile to get the recipe right using the pipe club in Pennsylvania to critique it.
I like both blends and find them satisfyingly delicious, with quality leaf.
Itg manufactures backwood cigars, and from Pipes and cigars:”, emphasis on “they”:
“ Backwoods Original cigars are among the most popular flavor-infused cigars available. So, they thought it was high time to bring that pleasant flavor and aroma to pipe lovers, so, please welcome Backwoods Original Pipe Tobacco. This is a cool-smoking aromatic blend with a smooth and mellow sweet flavor that smells terrific. Backwoods Original Pipe Tobacco delivers on every note, including the affordable price. If you've tried and enjoyed the cigars, you're going to love the pipe tobacco.”
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2021 11:34:58 GMT -5
Although you may notice a similarity to blackwoods cigars, they share no genealogy with the cigars. Dan Johnston, and Simon Thurlow started Standard tobacco, and resurrected the blend. Relying on old samples that were sent off to an Israeli lab to determine the components, Dan and Simon kept their findings confidential. They employed the help of their friend Russ Oulette, tobacco blender. Without knowing what the lab findings were and relying on his palate, he correctly named the components and Dan and Simon checked off the boxes. From then on, they worked quite awhile to get the recipe right using the pipe club in Pennsylvania to critique it. I like both blends and find them satisfyingly delicious, with quality leaf. Itg manufactures backwood cigars, and from Pipes and cigars:”, emphasis on “they”: “ Backwoods Original cigars are among the most popular flavor-infused cigars available. So, they thought it was high time to bring that pleasant flavor and aroma to pipe lovers, so, please welcome Backwoods Original Pipe Tobacco. This is a cool-smoking aromatic blend with a smooth and mellow sweet flavor that smells terrific. Backwoods Original Pipe Tobacco delivers on every note, including the affordable price. If you've tried and enjoyed the cigars, you're going to love the pipe tobacco.” I am familiar with the story. Simon and Dan's initiative was discussed at length on another forum.  And I am glad you enjoy the line. Not me, unfortunately. As to ITG, one problem is that Tobacco Reviews lists Sutliff as the manufacturer of some of the Backwoods blends; but other Backwoods have Mac Baren listed as the manufacturer. Now, we know Sutliff is now owned by Mac Baren (well, since a few years anyway), so it's the same, really, in a sense. Also, Backwoods is on Sutliff's website as part of their products. But the brand is listed on Mac Baren's website as well. www.sutliff-tobacco.com/pipe-tobacco/backwoods-value-blend/mac-baren.com/backwoods/It is possible that somebody at ITG developed the recipes and it was contracted to Sutliff/Mac Baren for production? However, what is interesting is that War Horse is nowhere to be seen on either websites as part of the products. So....are they manufactured by Sutliff, or another company? The tins themselves say nothing about it. In any case, it remains a mystery that I make such an association between War Horse and Backwoods cigars. But I can't help it as I have smoked a lot of these cigars in the past. |
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Post by papipeguy on Jun 1, 2021 12:04:03 GMT -5
The War Horse blends and trademarks are now owned by Cigars International and sold through P&C. As president of Standard Tobacco of Pennsylvania I sold the trademarks for our entire portfolio to International Cigars a couple of years ago. Sutliff is the manufacturer for the blends.
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Post by pepesdad1 on Jun 1, 2021 12:43:59 GMT -5
The War Horse blends and trademarks are now owned by Cigars International and sold through P&C. As president of Standard Tobacco of Pennsylvania I sold the trademarks for our entire portfolio to International Cigars a couple of years ago. Sutliff is the manufacturer for the blends. ...and there you have it...couldn't be plainer than that! I was happy to tell others about Warhorse Bar as I thought it was really done well...some like it and some don't...what makes the world go round. |
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Post by trailboss on Jun 1, 2021 13:47:46 GMT -5
“ It is possible that somebody at ITG developed the recipes and it was contracted to Sutliff/Mac Baren for production?”
Probably right, that is a common practice in the industry.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2021 16:40:20 GMT -5
The War Horse blends and trademarks are now owned by Cigars International and sold through P&C. As president of Standard Tobacco of Pennsylvania I sold the trademarks for our entire portfolio to International Cigars a couple of years ago. Sutliff is the manufacturer for the blends. Thanks for the info! |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2021 16:42:39 GMT -5
The War Horse blends and trademarks are now owned by Cigars International and sold through P&C. As president of Standard Tobacco of Pennsylvania I sold the trademarks for our entire portfolio to International Cigars a couple of years ago. Sutliff is the manufacturer for the blends. ...and there you have it...couldn't be plainer than that! I was happy to tell others about Warhorse Bar as I thought it was really done well...some like it and some don't...what makes the world go round. Absolutely. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 5, 2021 20:46:31 GMT -5
The War Horse blends and trademarks are now owned by Cigars International and sold through P&C. As president of Standard Tobacco of Pennsylvania I sold the trademarks for our entire portfolio to International Cigars a couple of years ago. Sutliff is the manufacturer for the blends. Love your War Horse Bar, John! My wife actually likes the room note. She's never liked the aroma of any other blend. |
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Post by qmechanics on Jun 6, 2021 9:03:35 GMT -5
Another conspiracy laid to rest, thank goodness!!😀
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Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2021 14:42:59 GMT -5
Another conspiracy laid to rest, thank goodness!!😀 Conspiracy...? |
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Post by fadingdaylight on Jun 6, 2021 17:49:17 GMT -5
Another conspiracy laid to rest, thank goodness!!😀 Conspiracy...? That's just Q's sense of humor |
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Post by trailboss on Jun 6, 2021 18:16:40 GMT -5
I was going to say a heresy committed by Lordguy, but I am a commoner and would like to keep my head.
Just kidding.😉
I can understand why the original question was asked, everyone’s palate is different, and some flavors are obvious to some, not so much for others. The longer I smoke, I think individual ph differences allow for a lot of different opinions on tobacco’s.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2021 8:01:22 GMT -5
Indeed. People's palates are as unique as every piece of briar is. The experience we accumulate as pipe smokers is also something unique from one individual to the other.
I still find troubling, though, this association I make with the Backwoods cigars. It is consistent every time I smell the tin aroma, light up and taste it. I will put the tin away for some time and revisit later.
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Post by sparks on Jun 7, 2021 10:58:09 GMT -5
To add my two cents to this discussion, let us not forget that the casings/flavorings used in flavored cigars may often be similar, or exactly the same as those used in commercially processed tobacco. There is always the chance this could account for crossover similarities, regardless of who is or is not manufacturing the blend or cigars.
The world of tobacco and tobacco flavorings is not that big these days.
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Post by sloopjohnb on Jul 19, 2021 15:24:03 GMT -5
cannot stand green - despised it so much that one of the creators sent me a sample of Condor
I hear good things about the red though -
overall not a lakeland guy - I don't even enjoy Bruno that much
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Hand of Glory
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Post by Hand of Glory on Jul 19, 2021 18:37:57 GMT -5
cannot stand green - despised it so much that one of the creators sent me a sample of Condor I hear good things about the red though - overall not a lakeland guy - I don't even enjoy Bruno that much I like Warhorse Bar. It’s a stiff but enjoyable smoke. I came over form cigar smoking so it was a nice transitional tobacco. |
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Post by trailboss on Jul 19, 2021 18:39:32 GMT -5
cannot stand green - despised it so much that one of the creators sent me a sample of Condor I hear good things about the red though - overall not a lakeland guy - I don't even enjoy Bruno that much Thumbkins or stretch rack for this new guy? We need to take a poll.  |
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Post by Ronv69 on Jul 19, 2021 18:46:22 GMT -5
cannot stand green - despised it so much that one of the creators sent me a sample of Condor I hear good things about the red though - overall not a lakeland guy - I don't even enjoy Bruno that much Thumbkins or stretch rack for this new guy? We need to take a poll. I agree with him and I have the most posts! 😜🤠😂 |
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Post by pepesdad1 on Jul 19, 2021 18:50:12 GMT -5
cannot stand green - despised it so much that one of the creators sent me a sample of CondorI hear good things about the red though - overall not a lakeland guy - I don't even enjoy Bruno that much Thumbkins or stretch rack for this new guy? We need to take a poll. A Sample of Condor...now that is something I really could get behind... Irish Condor was wonderful...the Polish, is unfortunately, just terrible to my tastes. Wish the guys would put their heads together and develop some of the taste of Irish Condor. I would sell all my McClellands just to get some of the old Condor. |
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Post by sloopjohnb on Jul 19, 2021 18:55:26 GMT -5
It was the original Irish Condor indeed. Simon, one of the creators intended Green to be a Condor-esque blend - unfortunately they got it all wrong and were left with what some find lovely and others find as appealing as toilet bowl cleaner
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Post by trailboss on Jul 19, 2021 19:10:24 GMT -5
It was the original Irish Condor indeed. Simon, one of the creators intended Green to be a Condor-esque blend - unfortunately they got it all wrong and were left with what some find lovely and others find as appealing as toilet bowl cleaner How is Simon doing? I miss the rascal, the only reason I have the old condor in the cellar is because of him. |
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Post by trailboss on Jul 19, 2021 19:12:07 GMT -5
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Post by sloopjohnb on Jul 20, 2021 9:05:40 GMT -5
It was the original Irish Condor indeed. Simon, one of the creators intended Green to be a Condor-esque blend - unfortunately they got it all wrong and were left with what some find lovely and others find as appealing as toilet bowl cleaner How is Simon doing? I miss the rascal, the only reason I have the old condor in the cellar is because of him. He's still a rascal alright - he's got everyone on the philt-pad kick - these small moisture absorbing things you put in the chamber |
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Post by Ronv69 on Jul 20, 2021 9:14:47 GMT -5
How is Simon doing? I miss the rascal, the only reason I have the old condor in the cellar is because of him. He's still a rascal alright - he's got everyone on the philt-pad kick - these small moisture absorbing things you put in the chamber I have a couple of pipes that the draft hole is too open and I use them to be able to smoke without sucking in tobacco. They work well. |
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