Zach
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Posts: 4,052
First Name: Zach
Favorite Pipe: Too many currently, bound to change
Favorite Tobacco: Haunted Bookshop, Big 'N' Burley, Pegasus, Habana Daydream, OJK, Rum Twist, FVF, Escudo, Orlik Golden Sliced, Kendal Flake, Ennerdale
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Post by Zach on Jun 21, 2017 11:06:01 GMT -5
Hello folks. These aren't new pipes to me, but in looking into histories on several pipes I own, I came back to Merkur 2000 and it's mysteries. Please input anything you may know if you know anything at all about Merkur pipes. About 2 years ago now, I found a Merkur 2000 volcano at a large antiques mall in North Florida. I'd been looking through all the pipes, accessing their grain pattern underneath all the crud and years of tarnish and sun fade. All their other pipes were fairly high priced for how heavily smoked they were, or they maybe were asking $75 or something crazy for a beat up Kaywoodie Whitebriar that would ultimately have to have all the white touched up or completely stripped. Anyway, I saw this Merkur 2000 volcano and I'd never heard of the pipe brand. I also did not own a volcano shape and had wanted one for years. I get it home and immediately posted some pictures to Anthony (Piffyr, thenewguy) who restores pipes, and does about the best job I've seen at restoring old pipes. He also didn't know anything about it, but we did some digging. As best as we could come up with, they were from a West-German men's razor company from the early 1980's before the reunification in Germany. Today upon digging, I still cannot find any new Merkur 2000 pipes, and in fact, the only two pictures of these pipes I've been able to really find, I own the pipes! For example, I just happened upon this. Merkur 2000 #720 Volcano Which I'm almost 100% certain is in fact, my pipe. Due to grain, and never being able to find another one. I believe the person that bought this pipe from this auction, happened to upsell it to me through their huge showcase they have in an Antiques Mall in Florida. Here it is, fully restored and in all it's glory. Restored VersionRestored Version front/back view
Here's a link to Reborn Briar's blog (Steve Laug) who was helping pinpoint info on the pipes, and Anthony Cook restored it. A West-German MysteryThis one I found here is actually different than the bent heeled apple that I got from @truculentfrogs in that it appears to be a half bent egg or possibly apple but the picture is terrible. #722This is the bent heeled apple that @truculentfrogs gifted to me after he noticed I had one of their pipes. Merkur 2000 "Bent Heeled Apple"There you have it. I'm looking for any information anyone may possibly have, and there's almost no info out there. Anyone happen to have one of these pipes? Regards, Zach |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2017 14:07:31 GMT -5
There a mystery for sure Zach. I contacted the German piper Marcus, when I first got the bent heel Apple and he had no idea either. I also think that Vauen or Design Berlin can be eliminated as the maker as they are not 9mm.
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Post by papipeguy on Jun 21, 2017 15:13:12 GMT -5
I hope St. Valentine sees this thread. He may be able to shed some light.
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Post by stvalentine on Jun 21, 2017 15:24:05 GMT -5
It´s a mistery for me too. The reference to razors leads to "Merkur Solingen" which is under one roof with the brand "DOVO". www.merkur-rasierer.de/Maybe the pipe was a giveaway for marketing reasons? |
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Zach
Pro Member
If you can't send money, send tobacco.
Posts: 4,052
First Name: Zach
Favorite Pipe: Too many currently, bound to change
Favorite Tobacco: Haunted Bookshop, Big 'N' Burley, Pegasus, Habana Daydream, OJK, Rum Twist, FVF, Escudo, Orlik Golden Sliced, Kendal Flake, Ennerdale
Location:
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Post by Zach on Jun 21, 2017 15:37:31 GMT -5
It´s a mistery for me too. The reference to razors leads to "Merkur Solingen" which is under one roof with the brand "DOVO". www.merkur-rasierer.de/Maybe the pipe was a giveaway for marketing reasons? Would that company have been around in the early to mid 1980's and would it have been located in "West-germany"? Can't recall the name, but there was another pipe with the same stamping, but a different brand and was also stamped with "2000" next to the name. Steve Laug located the similarities on Pipehil, but that's as far as we got. It may just remain a mystery. Wonder if Herbert Motzek or Hans knew anything about them. This from Steve Laug of RebornBriars: rebornpipes Post author October 4, 2015 at 6:55 pm Anthony peaked my interest on this mystery. I had some time today so I did a bit of digging. I wrote Anthony the following note. Anthony I came across a possible connection for the pipe. As many British Department stores sold proprietary pipes I am wondering if a German department store did not do the same. There was a German Department store called Merkur Department Store, in early 20th century Stuttgart, Germany. Might be worth exploring! Anthony took this and ran with it and sent me this response: High five, Steve! I believe that you may have cracked the egg a bit. A bit of cursory looking also found this: “Horten AG (Aktiengesellschaft) was a German department store chain founded by Helmut Horten in 1936 and headquartered in Düsseldorf, Germany. With up to 80 stores all over Germany, Horten ranked fourth-largest among German department store chains, after Karstadt, Kaufhof and Hertie. Until 1988, Horten operated some of its department stores under the name of Merkur,..” From here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horten_AGThat might explain the “H” stamp on the stem. I’m going to do some more digging later this evening when I have some time. Thanks again, Steve! Anthony More to come as the mystery may well be unfolding. The Horten department stores could be a good lead because if you'll notice in the restored pictures, the original stems have a right shifted/slanted H stamped in them. Possibly from Horten department stores, possibly something to do with Merkur razors, possible as well that the H in the stem signified where it was from, and that Merkur 2000 was a model, as Steve thought. Quick recap on what I know so far. Possibly a pipe made under the Horten AG department stores brand. Horten was acquired by the British-American Tobacco company so there is at least a tobacco link in there. The H is the best link we have for that claim. To get further, we'd almost need some German old timers who were very familiar with Horten department stores while they were booming and creating supermarkets in the basement and delis, and all that before Horten sold his shares and sold to the tobacco company. I suspect early 80's on these pipes, and it was at the very least before the 1990 reunification. Whoops, old timers that were familiar with the stores in the early 80's, not before he sold his shares in the 60's. I've learned that the "AG" just means "Joint-Stock Company" in Germany "Aktiengesellschaft." |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2017 16:13:45 GMT -5
Fellow member, sidstavros, restores a lot of European pipes. Perhaps he has knowledge of them? If he does not see this thread, you could send him a PM.
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Post by stvalentine on Jun 21, 2017 16:20:48 GMT -5
The last time I shopped at Horten Department stores I was still a kid, so no pipe smoking back then for me. The lik to Horten sounds much more possible to me than the link to the cutlery business of DOVO/Merkur. German department stores always had a lot of their own brands made by other companies too.
You´re right about the Aktiengesellschaft. AG´s sell their stocks and gather capital by this.
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Post by stvalentine on Jun 21, 2017 16:24:54 GMT -5
Ok, I found more infos: Merkur were the cheaper department stores of Helmut Horten, Nevertheless he tried to make them more posh by offering more "lifeytyle" products - including pipes! The products had a stylized "H" on them too!
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Zach
Pro Member
If you can't send money, send tobacco.
Posts: 4,052
First Name: Zach
Favorite Pipe: Too many currently, bound to change
Favorite Tobacco: Haunted Bookshop, Big 'N' Burley, Pegasus, Habana Daydream, OJK, Rum Twist, FVF, Escudo, Orlik Golden Sliced, Kendal Flake, Ennerdale
Location:
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Post by Zach on Jun 21, 2017 16:39:25 GMT -5
Ok, I found more infos: Merkur were the cheaper department stores of Helmut Horten, Nevertheless he tried to make them more posh by offering more "lifeytyle" products - including pipes! The products had a stylized "H" on them too! Could you possibly link to or paste that info you've found? I think you may have found the missing link! So, Horten also had stores called Merkur? |
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Post by stvalentine on Jun 21, 2017 16:47:57 GMT -5
This is the Helmut Horten Story - one hell of a merchant! Unfortunately it is only in German. www.zeit.de/1972/02/die-goldenen-zwanzig-jahreHorten was buying and eventually selling several departement stores and became a billionaire by this. MERKUR was one of those department store chains that offered pipes too. All those stores are gone now but I remember being at the Hamburg store when I was a child. American Tobacco bought some of his stocks in 1971 but I don´t believe this is in connection with the selling of pipes back then. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2017 16:50:47 GMT -5
Terrific detective work, Frank. ++++++
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Zach
Pro Member
If you can't send money, send tobacco.
Posts: 4,052
First Name: Zach
Favorite Pipe: Too many currently, bound to change
Favorite Tobacco: Haunted Bookshop, Big 'N' Burley, Pegasus, Habana Daydream, OJK, Rum Twist, FVF, Escudo, Orlik Golden Sliced, Kendal Flake, Ennerdale
Location:
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Post by Zach on Jun 21, 2017 17:45:19 GMT -5
This is the Helmut Horten Story - one hell of a merchant! Unfortunately it is only in German. www.zeit.de/1972/02/die-goldenen-zwanzig-jahreHorten was buying and eventually selling several departement stores and became a billionaire by this. MERKUR was one of those department store chains that offered pipes too. All those stores are gone now but I remember being at the Hamburg store when I was a child. American Tobacco bought some of his stocks in 1971 but I don´t believe this is in connection with the selling of pipes back then. Thank you, sir! I can read some German and translate the rest. Surely, I wouldn't expect a German article to be in English. I'm going to definitively rest on this being where the pipes came from. Any possible link you may have to the infamous "H" stamping on other Horten or Merkur products would be terrific but certainly not necessary. This is enough closure for me, but if you possibly do some searching and find out what maker made the shop pipes for Merkur department stores, that would be awesome! Take care, and thank you again. |
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Post by stvalentine on Jun 22, 2017 14:24:25 GMT -5
Thank you guys, you´re most welcome. I believe this is as close as we can get for now. One thing that still bothers me is the shape of the Horten "H" which looks not exactly right. Anyway, I think it is more probable that the pipes were sold by a department store than a cutlery company.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2017 14:32:40 GMT -5
There is also a large tobac house in Germany: Huber Munchen.
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Post by stvalentine on Jun 22, 2017 15:10:36 GMT -5
Huber has a nice shop in Munich (I am just smoking one of their tobaccos) and Diehl in Munich has even greater tobaccos. Hamburg has a nice selection of tobacco / pipe dealers too.
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Zach
Pro Member
If you can't send money, send tobacco.
Posts: 4,052
First Name: Zach
Favorite Pipe: Too many currently, bound to change
Favorite Tobacco: Haunted Bookshop, Big 'N' Burley, Pegasus, Habana Daydream, OJK, Rum Twist, FVF, Escudo, Orlik Golden Sliced, Kendal Flake, Ennerdale
Location:
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Post by Zach on Jun 22, 2017 16:56:41 GMT -5
Glad to hear you still have good tobacco and pipe retailers over there. The only German tobaccos I've been able to try are a few of the Motzek blends, and I still have some Strang, HU Tobaccos, and Dan Tobacco. A lot of Dan stuff is too goopy and aromatic for me, but they still make all great quality tobaccos. HU has a slew of greats.
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Post by stvalentine on Jun 23, 2017 14:48:44 GMT -5
If I had to smoke only DAN Tobaccos products for the rest of my life I´d be a happy camper! They´ve got so many awesome tobaccos and I am only talking about the non-aro stuff. Having HU and Motzek here in the land of limited possibilities is great too.
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Post by crapgame on Jun 25, 2017 1:18:55 GMT -5
Gordan pym is on myu wish list framk!
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