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Post by lestrout on Sept 1, 2017 22:53:34 GMT -5
Or maybe I should rephrase this, since the term 'hoarder' could be taken as a pejorative. Even though the FDA Deeming regs may be in a bit of a pause for now, I am struck by how fast HTF blends vanish from the shelves when they hit the market. Granted that there are only a fraction of a percent of the general population that indulge in the pipe, and yet another small fraction of that who consider tobacco as a hobby, some of which hang out in forums, Reddit, YouTube and other social media. Do you think there are only/as many volume accumulators = hoarders as a thousand or so? Or perhaps just a few hundred, many of whom make themselves known on the forums?
I'm thinking of the new blends which might only have a few hundred tins, and purchasers are restricted to one or two. P&C's recent Goodie Box promotion was limited to the first qualifying 750 buyers, and it probably lasted only a few hours. I'm trying to figure out a good metric to get at this.
hples
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Post by just ol ed on Sept 1, 2017 22:59:28 GMT -5
dunno if I even qualify as a hoarder. A tad less than 7 total lbs. Opened & working on, 965 & BestBlend (couple oz, then bring up another few for drying). Unopened: daVinci, Abingdon, Blackpoint, 10Russians, Exotique.
all dated '06
Ed Duncan, Batavia, NY
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Post by crapgame on Sept 2, 2017 7:43:14 GMT -5
My wife thinks I have "LOTS" of tobacco but it really is about 30 mason jars with tobacco..maybe 3 leaves of a few types of burley and VA ..and about 10 tins of unopened tobacco..thats about it for me...and myh wife rolls her eyes when I have a few samples of tobacco samples show up in the mail.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2017 7:52:12 GMT -5
"Cellaring is what I do; hoarding is what others do."
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Post by Wolfman on Sept 2, 2017 8:26:58 GMT -5
I've been building up my cellar over the past six months. I try to purchase an equal number of Balkan/Orientals, VAPer, VaPerBur and VAs. I have about nine pounds of unopened tins/jars. I will crack a tin when needed, and others are for the future.
I usually purchase an additional tin or two of my favorite with each order. It's partially due to the Stasi, I mean FDA. Also, if history has taught us anything, it's that tobaccos can disappear, anytime and without notice. I.E. original Dunhill, Sorbanie of London, etc. I don't want to open a tin of Westminster and find out it's made by STC. That would break my heart.
I also think I may have TAD.
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Post by peterd-Buffalo Spirit on Sept 2, 2017 9:36:29 GMT -5
...I've been building my cellar for over 40 years...need I say more???
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Post by danno44 on Sept 2, 2017 9:40:42 GMT -5
"Cellaring is what I do; hoarding is what others do." This is me as well. I was building a cellar prior to the Deeming Rule release. All that did was accelerated my cellaring. I have a decent cellar fairly wide and pretty deep on a handful of blends I smoke daily. My cellar, large to some folks, but no as much as a few other members here that I am aware of. I only buy baccy now if it's on sale. If stumble on hard to find baccy (Estorica, Germain blends) then I'll pay retail but never more than retail. I will drop extra if I come across discontinued blends (Murray Dunhill, 3 Nuns etc), which I haven't found yet, at least at what I consider a reasonable cost. Not paying 100 bucks a tin type thing, don't need to with the cellar I've built. |
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Post by haebar on Sept 2, 2017 9:50:42 GMT -5
"Cellaring is what I do; hoarding is what others do." This is me as well. I was building a cellar prior to the Deeming Rule release. All that did was accelerated my cellaring. I have a decent cellar fairly wide and pretty deep on a handful of blends I smoke daily. My cellar, large to some folks, but no as much as a few other members here that I am aware of. I only buy baccy now if it's on sale. If stumble on hard to find baccy (Estorica, Germain blends) then I'll pay retail but never more than retail. I will drop extra if I come across discontinued blends (Murray Dunhill, 3 Nuns etc), which I haven't found yet, at least at what I consider a reasonable cost. Not paying 100 bucks a tin type thing, don't need to with the cellar I've built. What danno44 said applies to me. |
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Zach
Pro Member
If you can't send money, send tobacco.
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Post by Zach on Sept 2, 2017 11:23:02 GMT -5
There are about a few thousand people regularly buying pipe tobacco, a bit more than total active users across the forums. This is a rough estimate, a few thousand may also only be a rough metric for the US, as I'm not including the UK, Germany, or anywhere else where they stick mainly to forums in their native language, and order mainly in their own countries.
I cellar but with half a ton being about the largest cellar I know of, 600 some pounds being 2nd and 3rd largest, I'm really tiny with a cellar no larger than a current 25-30 pounds. It's always slightly growing, but I've slowed quite a bit this last year.
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Post by JimInks on Sept 2, 2017 11:54:39 GMT -5
Cellaring tends to be mostly done by Americans. The majority of overseas smokers buy what they need when they need it, mostly due to pricing. Those who do cellar have small ones, usually a couple pounds or so. In fact, that was a major reason we saw MacBaren introduce 50 grams tins to market in the last couple years. They are easier to carry, and less money is spent at a time on a single blend.
Les, I imagine your average smoker who is not on the internet is doing little cellaring, especially if they are OTC smokers. Some are not likely to even be aware of the FDA regulations, and would see little reason to cellar. I'm sure talk goes on about it at B&Ms, so those who patronize them are likely aware of the current situation, and as it is in the best interest of shops to sell now, and worry about later when it's later, are probably cellaring to some extent. But, I imagine most cellaring is done by those who surf the 'net, and I imagine more don't tell what they do than those who do. So, there's no definite answer to your question.
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Zach
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Post by Zach on Sept 2, 2017 11:58:29 GMT -5
Good points, Jim.
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Post by trailboss on Sept 2, 2017 12:07:35 GMT -5
As soon as I took up the pipe after a 25 year+ hiatus, and discovered that there was more than the solitary blend I used to smoke, I quickly tried to find out what I like most, and I have been buying a lot of tobaccos...I have an antique buffet cabinet totally loaded with jarred bulks, and a two drawer file cabinet (each drawer holds double files) totally full with tinned tobacco's...I also have 4 mason jar flats (half pint jars) stacked outside the cabinet.
In a couple months when the wife is gone for a week, I am pulling it all out and inventorying it...she would probably crap her pants if she knew how much money I spent or she saw the volume. I couldn't hazard a guess on how much I have, but to buy any more is probably pointless unless it is a few of this and that. Once I found out that pipe tobacco taxes are far less, and no tax on internet purchases along with way cheaper than buying from a b&M...and nothing will be cheaper in the future, plus what the gub'mint could do...it is a no brainer.
I have never paid for shipping separately in any of my online purchases, everything has been at the $99.00, or when they offer free shipping at the $49 level.
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sablebrush52
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Post by sablebrush52 on Sept 2, 2017 12:19:57 GMT -5
Hi Les,
That's a very interesting question. Let's assume that there are about 500,000 pipe smokers in the US. It's probably a lot more than that, but let's be conservative about the aggregate number, so a little more than one in a thousand. And let's say that about 1% of those are really actively involved with pipes and tobaccos, like it's a big part of their daily existence. So that leaves about 5,000 who seriously accumulate pipes and tobaccos - a hundred or more pipes and a hundred or more pounds of tobacco. Not a big number, but a believable one. Personally, my guess is that the number is bigger, but this result seems reasonably defensible.
I haven't been cellaring for all that long. I wasn't one of those guys who needed to try everything or have hundreds of pipes. But about 10 years ago I just found myself wanting more change than my 10 pipes and three to four tobaccos. Once the monster was released, there was no stopping it. But by many standards, my collapse into the ooze of PAD and TAD has been moderate. I have about 130 working pipes, the vast majority of them being Barlings. I've had a lot of fun collecting them and learning about the history and lore of the British pipe industry.
My entry into the wide world of pipe tobaccos developed a bit later and now I have a small cellar of about 120 lbs. At my age, given how much I smoke, it's a double lifetime supply. So I've slowed down on purchases of both pipes and tobaccos. And if I were even slightly sane, I'd stop altogether. What I wanted was to have choices and that's been achieved.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2017 14:17:36 GMT -5
I prefer to think of myself as a collector and connoisseur.  |
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Zach
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Post by Zach on Sept 2, 2017 14:52:06 GMT -5
Hi Les, That's a very interesting question. Let's assume that there are about 500,000 pipe smokers in the US. It's probably a lot more than that, but let's be conservative about the aggregate number, so a little more than one in a thousand. And let's say that about 1% of those are really actively involved with pipes and tobaccos, like it's a big part of their daily existence. So that leaves about 5,000 who seriously accumulate pipes and tobaccos - a hundred or more pipes and a hundred or more pounds of tobacco. Not a big number, but a believable one. Personally, my guess is that the number is bigger, but this result seems reasonably defensible. I haven't been cellaring for all that long. I wasn't one of those guys who needed to try everything or have hundreds of pipes. But about 10 years ago I just found myself wanting more change than my 10 pipes and three to four tobaccos. Once the monster was released, there was no stopping it. But by many standards, my collapse into the ooze of PAD and TAD has been moderate. I have about 130 working pipes, the vast majority of them being Barlings. I've had a lot of fun collecting them and learning about the history and lore of the British pipe industry. My entry into the wide world of pipe tobaccos developed a bit later and now I have a small cellar of about 120 lbs. At my age, given how much I smoke, it's a double lifetime supply. So I've slowed down on purchases of both pipes and tobaccos. And if I were even slightly sane, I'd stop altogether. What I wanted was to have choices and that's been achieved. 😀 You're being a little conservative with the term moderate there, Jesse. 120 pounds is more tobacco than THREE nice B&Ms in my city carry altogether. When you have over $4-5,000 worth of only tobacco leaf sitting in your house, you are easily up there in the top couple hundred people in the US, of course by those known via forums and tobaccocellar.com and other metrics. Of course I'm just ribbing you a bit, but you don't have a moderate amount by most standards, you have quite a lot. You have some very nice pipes as well. I think you've been cellaring for a good 4-5 years longer than I have and I'll also most likely have over 100 pounds in the next few years. I don't see a problem with it. It will also become more and more of a commodity so it's like sitting on silver bars stockpiled, to me. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2017 15:32:28 GMT -5
Americans are brainwashed from childhood to think they always need more. Advertising has us thinking we need MORE of everything, and that everything we have, needs to be constantly upgraded. Phones, cars, houses, Owning just one of something is never enough. I'm as guilty as most of the middle class is, and am now of circumstances in my life where I've had to sell a good majority of material items the last 3 years since losing my health. Seeing people with 100 pipes and 100 pounds of tobacco accumulated gives me mixed emotions. Google up abject poverty or look at the statistics that 1/2 of all the worlds population lives on less than $3.00 a day, with 1% owning 40% of the total money in the world, and the word insanity comes to mind.
With the upcoming regulations on tobacco, I can see cellaring tobacco. But that means that our relatives will end up disposing of it before we get to use all of it.
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sablebrush52
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Post by sablebrush52 on Sept 2, 2017 15:47:52 GMT -5
Hi Les, That's a very interesting question. Let's assume that there are about 500,000 pipe smokers in the US. It's probably a lot more than that, but let's be conservative about the aggregate number, so a little more than one in a thousand. And let's say that about 1% of those are really actively involved with pipes and tobaccos, like it's a big part of their daily existence. So that leaves about 5,000 who seriously accumulate pipes and tobaccos - a hundred or more pipes and a hundred or more pounds of tobacco. Not a big number, but a believable one. Personally, my guess is that the number is bigger, but this result seems reasonably defensible. I haven't been cellaring for all that long. I wasn't one of those guys who needed to try everything or have hundreds of pipes. But about 10 years ago I just found myself wanting more change than my 10 pipes and three to four tobaccos. Once the monster was released, there was no stopping it. But by many standards, my collapse into the ooze of PAD and TAD has been moderate. I have about 130 working pipes, the vast majority of them being Barlings. I've had a lot of fun collecting them and learning about the history and lore of the British pipe industry. My entry into the wide world of pipe tobaccos developed a bit later and now I have a small cellar of about 120 lbs. At my age, given how much I smoke, it's a double lifetime supply. So I've slowed down on purchases of both pipes and tobaccos. And if I were even slightly sane, I'd stop altogether. What I wanted was to have choices and that's been achieved. 😀 You're being a little conservative with the term moderate there, Jesse. 120 pounds is more tobacco than THREE nice B&Ms in my city carry altogether. When you have over $4-5,000 worth of only tobacco leaf sitting in your house, you are easily up there in the top couple hundred people in the US, of course by those known via forums and tobaccocellar.com and other metrics. Of course I'm just ribbing you a bit, but you don't have a moderate amount by most standards, you have quite a lot. You have some very nice pipes as well. I think you've been cellaring for a good 4-5 years longer than I have and I'll also most likely have over 100 pounds in the next few years. I don't see a problem with it. It will also become more and more of a commodity so it's like sitting on silver bars stockpiled, to me. Yeah, being in the belly of the beast can be disorienting. Compared to the 200-300 pipe collections mine feels quite moderate. And I don't spend thousands, or even many hundreds, on a pipe. Should I end up not smoking the cellar I've left instructions in my will about what to do with it, assuming I don't just rent a table at a pipe show or two, and sell most of it off. But I wonder how many large collectors are "out in the wild", not participating in any social medium. I know from personal experience that there are a number of well heeled collectors who maintain complete anonymity. They're not on eBay, nor on PM, PSF, TBP, or any of that. They know each other in a limited way and introduction is word of mouth and personal. I suspect that the best of the best is completely unknown to us. |
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sablebrush52
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Post by sablebrush52 on Sept 2, 2017 16:10:18 GMT -5
Americans are brainwashed from childhood to think they always need more. Advertising has us thinking we need MORE of everything, and that everything we have, needs to be constantly upgraded. Phones, cars, houses, Owning just one of something is never enough. I'm as guilty as most of the middle class is, and am now of circumstances in my life where I've had to sell a good majority of material items the last 3 years since losing my health. Seeing people with 100 pipes and 100 pounds of tobacco accumulated gives me mixed emotions. Google up abject poverty or look at the statistics that 1/2 of all the worlds population lives on less than $3.00 a day, with 1% owning 40% of the total money in the world, and the word insanity comes to mind. With the upcoming regulations on tobacco, I can see cellaring tobacco. But that means that our relatives will end up disposing of it before we get to use all of it. Insanity is definitely a good descriptor. I can also understand why, given widespread misery, all this seems like irresponsible indulgence, and the same can be said for large houses, luxury cars, boats, gun collections, ammo stocks, jewelry, make up, air conditioning, antiques, vacations, large wardrobes, eating in restaurants, going to the theater, first editions, big weddings, ornate caskets, cable, some form of PDA, a pricey watch, and tens of thousands, or more, other indulgences, pretty much anything beyond basic food, clothing, and shelter and the means to keep that intact on a basic level. The pipes and tobaccos are an extreme indulgence, and really my only one. I suppose I could have picked a much better one, but it's the one I picked. And it's something that I can later divest if I so desire, and get most of my cost back. Stupid, but mine. |
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Post by jpberg on Sept 2, 2017 18:42:27 GMT -5
I have about 100 pounds of Dark Plug, and other assorted stuff. If I thought for a minute that it would be available forever I would only buy it 25g at a time, as I prefer it fresh.
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Zach
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If you can't send money, send tobacco.
Posts: 4,367
First Name: Zach
Favorite Pipe: Too many currently, bound to change
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Post by Zach on Sept 2, 2017 20:28:39 GMT -5
I have about 100 pounds of Dark Plug, and other assorted stuff. If I thought for a minute that it would be available forever I would only buy it 25g at a time, as I prefer it fresh. This is a great point, John. It's mostly me stocking up the blends I'm actually scared of losing. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2017 21:56:09 GMT -5
Americans are brainwashed from childhood to think they always need more. Advertising has us thinking we need MORE of everything, and that everything we have, needs to be constantly upgraded. Phones, cars, houses, Owning just one of something is never enough. I'm as guilty as most of the middle class is, and am now of circumstances in my life where I've had to sell a good majority of material items the last 3 years since losing my health. Seeing people with 100 pipes and 100 pounds of tobacco accumulated gives me mixed emotions. Google up abject poverty or look at the statistics that 1/2 of all the worlds population lives on less than $3.00 a day, with 1% owning 40% of the total money in the world, and the word insanity comes to mind. With the upcoming regulations on tobacco, I can see cellaring tobacco. But that means that our relatives will end up disposing of it before we get to use all of it. Well hell, we need something to distract us from the collapse of civilization (as people have been saying since recorded history). But yeah, there's indulgence and then there's pointless excess. |
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Post by PhantomWolf on Sept 3, 2017 1:11:04 GMT -5
I always wonder how many people are buying tobacco for profit rather than pleasure. I must have three dozen email alerts set for blends I just hope to be able to try and they sell so quickly that I have a hard time believing it's people like myself who only buy a couple tins at a time.
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sablebrush52
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Post by sablebrush52 on Sept 3, 2017 2:33:36 GMT -5
I always wonder how many people are buying tobacco for profit rather than pleasure. I must have three dozen email alerts set for blends I just hope to be able to try and they sell so quickly that I have a hard time believing it's people like myself who only buy a couple tins at a time. Most online dealers impose strict limits on unobtainium order amounts. I suspect that it just the result of the feeding frenzy. That's why I don't bother with online stores when it comes to buying hart to find blends. |
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sablebrush52
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Post by sablebrush52 on Sept 3, 2017 2:44:47 GMT -5
Americans are brainwashed from childhood to think they always need more. Advertising has us thinking we need MORE of everything, and that everything we have, needs to be constantly upgraded. Phones, cars, houses, Owning just one of something is never enough. I'm as guilty as most of the middle class is, and am now of circumstances in my life where I've had to sell a good majority of material items the last 3 years since losing my health. Seeing people with 100 pipes and 100 pounds of tobacco accumulated gives me mixed emotions. Google up abject poverty or look at the statistics that 1/2 of all the worlds population lives on less than $3.00 a day, with 1% owning 40% of the total money in the world, and the word insanity comes to mind. With the upcoming regulations on tobacco, I can see cellaring tobacco. But that means that our relatives will end up disposing of it before we get to use all of it. Well hell, we need something to distract us from the collapse of civilization (as people have been saying since recorded history). But yeah, there's indulgence and then there's pointless excess. There's another aspect to this which hasn't been mentioned, aging. There are a number of blends that I like aged. I buy stock so that I can enjoy it after aging for a number of years. I'm at the point that I can smoke tins I bought 5 or more years ago and still have some aging on the shelf. To do that you need stock to rotate. I'm not going to find aged stack at my B&M. These days I don't find ANY stock at my local B&M. They've stopped stocking pipe tobacco because it doesn't sell, and are focused on cigars. And yes, this is a very first world concern. |
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Post by trailboss on Sept 3, 2017 9:52:56 GMT -5
There is only one logical reason not to cellar tobacco.
Jiminks is your roommate.
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Post by PhantomWolf on Sept 3, 2017 20:14:12 GMT -5
There is only one logical reason not to cellar tobacco. Jiminks is your roommate. Hahaha |
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Post by PhantomWolf on Sept 3, 2017 20:21:26 GMT -5
I always wonder how many people are buying tobacco for profit rather than pleasure. I must have three dozen email alerts set for blends I just hope to be able to try and they sell so quickly that I have a hard time believing it's people like myself who only buy a couple tins at a time. Most online dealers impose strict limits on unobtainium order amounts. I suspect that it just the result of the feeding frenzy. That's why I don't bother with online stores when it comes to buying hart to find blends. Good to know, SableBrush. After seeing the price some blends fetch on ebay etc, I had assumed some scalping was going on- Nice to know it isn't quite as I had imagined it to be. I also agree that this is a great reason to visit one's local B&M baccy shoppe. I certainly do not go there to spend $20 on a tin of Nightcap, but bulk prices are reasonable enough if I wanna give something a try and they do tend to have some of the rare stuff from time to time and I don't mind paying a premium for an occasional trophy smoke. haha |
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sablebrush52
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Post by sablebrush52 on Sept 3, 2017 22:28:46 GMT -5
There is only one logical reason not to cellar tobacco. Jiminks is your roommate. Given the rate at which Jim smokes, I think the need would be to have a bigger cellar, or guard dogs, preferably rabid ones. |
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sablebrush52
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Post by sablebrush52 on Sept 3, 2017 22:33:01 GMT -5
Most online dealers impose strict limits on unobtainium order amounts. I suspect that it just the result of the feeding frenzy. That's why I don't bother with online stores when it comes to buying hart to find blends. Good to know, SableBrush. After seeing the price some blends fetch on ebay etc, I had assumed some scalping was going on- Nice to know it isn't quite as I had imagined it to be. I also agree that this is a great reason to visit one's local B&M baccy shoppe. I certainly do not go there to spend $20 on a tin of Nightcap, but bulk prices are reasonable enough if I wanna give something a try and they do tend to have some of the rare stuff from time to time and I don't mind paying a premium for an occasional trophy smoke. haha There ave been a couple of eBay posts of large amounts of Esoterica and Balkan Sobranie that suggest to me that a dealer or two could be selling their stock at scalpers prices rather than in their shops. That would be a new development. If people refused to pay exorbitant prices, prices would drop. But people pay exorbitant prices. |
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Post by PhantomWolf on Sept 3, 2017 22:33:17 GMT -5
There is only one logical reason not to cellar tobacco. Jiminks is your roommate. Given the rate at which Jim smokes, I think the need would be to have a bigger cellar, or guard dogs, preferably rabid ones. If Jim is to tobacco what my current housemate is to beer, that would be an issue. I have considered putting a lock on the basement fridge and keeping my beer there. haha |
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