kirk13
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Posts: 674
First Name: John
Favorite Tobacco: GH Black and Brown
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Post by kirk13 on Jan 15, 2019 14:58:35 GMT -5
I mentioned earlier that I visited my 'local' b+m today,and,to be honest,I wasnt much impressed.
It got me to thinking,do these shops deserve to survive?
Back in 2017,when I was off work with anxiety, I was doing quite a lot if model building(1/10 scale motorbikes for what its worth). Mostly I'd have bought the consumables from my work as i got 35% discount off retail,but this wasnt an option,and I needed certain aerosols to finish the bike I was working on. My nearest b+m was two bus rides away. I headed off,bought the paint,and another kit besides. The whole time I was there,no one asked if I wanted help,or what I was looking for,or thanked me for my custom.
Now,I'm a veteran model builder...I didn't need the help,but to someone outside of the hobby,it would have been a disheartening experience. The prices at least matched the internet. But,and it's worth mentioning,this was one of the better stores for customer service. The standards of merchandising and store cleanliness were poor. My former housemate,who repped in the model trade was at a loss as to why b+Ms were closing. To me it was a no-brainer. Why be treated badly after two bus rides when I could have been lying in bed having a better shopping experience?
This brings me back to today...
It's the only tobacconist in Belfast...in three counties for that matter if Google hasn't lied to me. The assistant chose to sell me a £1.50 lighter instead of showing me the £15 one. None of the pipes or tobaccos were priced. The assistant didn't try to engage with me,to actually sell me anything. Now, I was going to make the argument that going to this store would save me handling charges over buying online, but I dont live in Belfast...it costs me at least £6 for a train fare. That would pretty much cover next day delivery.
If I want to know what a tobacco is like theres online resources such as this wonderful forum,or review sites featuring our own Jiminks.
So...I ask again,if B+Ms are like this,do they deserve to survive?
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Post by puffy on Jan 15, 2019 15:35:51 GMT -5
The closest B&M to me is about 10 miles away from me.They have a good selection of pipe tobacco and pipes.The service there is great.The problems that I have though is they're in a very high traffic area.Not easy to get to.The jars of pipe tobacco are on a shelf behind the counter.No way for the customer to get to them..Their prices are high for someone on a fixed income..In my opinion though this particular B&M definitely deserves to survive Though it caters mostly to working men who smoke cigars..
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Post by sperrytops on Jan 15, 2019 15:42:11 GMT -5
I don't think all B&Ms are like that. Some of the folks out here on the Patch have talked about some really wonderful B&Ms, as service goes. But the fact is, it's hard for B&Ms to compete at the same price point with online retailers. There's the cost of a good shop location and local taxes to deal with. So they have to offer something more than just a shop with shelves and product. What cigar retailers are doing is offering lounges and events (sometimes combining cigars with whisky tasting, for example) to create a community that people want to come to and join. This leads to improved sales. But there are a lot more cigar smokers, I think, than pipe smokers (maybe I'm wrong there). But certainly step 1 for a B&M is to create a really positive experience for those who come in so they want to come back. It doesn't sound like your B&M really did that. Just my thoughts, so take with a grain of salt.
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haveldad
Junior Member
Posts: 477
Favorite Pipe: Kaywoodie Freehand Poker
Favorite Tobacco: Vintage Syrian
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Post by haveldad on Jan 15, 2019 15:47:07 GMT -5
Bad businesses don't deserve to stay in business, Be it hobby store or tobacco store, some places just suck.
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Post by peteguy on Jan 15, 2019 15:49:24 GMT -5
Not mine - tobacco wise they price gouge, have a lack of stock and a piss poor attitude towards pipe tobacco. Cigars on the other hand are the opposite. They do have a good selection of pipes. I, like you, bought a lighter from them that they said was a solid as a rock. It lasted about 45 days. No return as it was used and past 30 days.
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Post by dervis on Jan 15, 2019 16:14:45 GMT -5
My local BM I would not call overly helpful. They sell way more cigars like the others listed here. They have a great selection of Pipes and Tobacco but their pricing is strange. They will have cheap grabows or La Roccas at 150 but then an obvious Sav 2nd in the basket for 20 bucks. Tins of tobacco for 22 dollars you can get online for 12. But next to that tins of out of production / cant find tobacco for the same 22 dollars a tin.
Not very helpful though. I still dont think they are hurting for business
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Post by roadsdiverged on Jan 15, 2019 16:17:22 GMT -5
My B&M is about 15 minutes away. In the 9 months I've been smoking a pipe I've only been in there 1 time. Right off the bat the guy (owner) told me he knew nothing about pipes or tobacco. After that I felt like I was bothering him with my business and that I took him away from something more important (his taxidermy shop next door). I was full of questions and I knew he couldnt answer them, so I grabbed a grabow and off I went, never looking back.
I've been to a few other b&m's down town and they always seem to be looking down on me. They cater to the upper class here. In a jewelry store downtown I was told by the owner that I couldnt afford what they had within 10 minutes of walking in. Little did they know that I just got a huge end of job bonus and I was there to buy my first wife an engagement ring. I could really care less if every b&m in my town shut their doors for good.
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Post by kxg on Jan 15, 2019 16:45:20 GMT -5
My nearest good B&M's (good defined as, has some decent pipe stuff and a good cigar humidor) are all at least 3.5 hours away. One of them is in a town I get to relatively frequently for meetings and such. So, I hope they survive. Do they deserve to survive? My favorite, yes. The folks behind the counter speak tobacco, and while they know cigars better, their pipe/tobacco knowledge is pretty decent. And, they have a nice lounge where the cigar smokers welcome a pipe smoker. Sadly, State & local law prohibits sale of liquor in the shop & lounge. That all said, if a shop provides virtually no service and poor product selection, they likely will not stay in business whether they deserve to or not, unless of course, the owners are rich and don't care.
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Post by addamsruspipe on Jan 15, 2019 16:54:35 GMT -5
My local Stag Tobacconist is one of the good ones. They are 60% cigars and 40% pipes/pipe tobacco. They know pipes and pipe tobacco and are happy to talk to you about it. They are also happy to work with new pipe smokers and educate them on how to smoke a pipe. 🙂
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2019 16:56:48 GMT -5
Well, once tobacco is banned from being sold online you’ll be seeing some new B&M’s back in business..........JMHO........it’s inevitable. Your basic tin tobacco’s that sells online now for around $10.00 will be selling for $21.95.......another good reason to build a good size cellar for your future.
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Post by trailboss on Jan 15, 2019 17:17:20 GMT -5
Bad businesses don't deserve to stay in business, Be it hobby store or tobacco store, some places just suck. Succinctly well stated. I just sat down on my lunch hour at Big Sticks, got a hearty welcome from the owner... we talked about how fortunate IPSD falls on the same Wednesday of the month we have our pipe night... he is an enthusiastic proprietor that has an attentive staff that is second to none... Ye Olde Pipe Shoppe down the road has a very good staff that knows their stuff, and the cigar lounges like Fox’s are really classy places without the snobbery. I am fortunate to live in such a great locale. |
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Post by Ronv69 on Jan 15, 2019 17:17:40 GMT -5
We have at least one great pipe shop in Houston that is in a very expensive neighborhood, but they are pleasant to everyone who comes in and very helpful. The other shops in the area are for the most part friendly, but their main business is cigars and they don't know much about pipes. They are mostly just people trying to make a living and doing their best. If they have some lousy employees the owners need to know. If it's the owner, well, what can you do. John Brandt's shop in Massachusetts is a great place, as well as Park Lane in New York. Don't damn all shops because of a few.
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Post by Dramatwist on Jan 15, 2019 17:18:11 GMT -5
...if a B&M has something to offer that is not available online, they will remain open and perhaps thrive. If not, they'll be gone. That's the way it is now...
...there are two tobacconists that have managed to stay open for business here in the Bay Area... "Telford's" and "The Piedmont Tobacconist"... they are very different from each other, but have something you can't get on the internet...
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Post by trailboss on Jan 15, 2019 17:23:07 GMT -5
It is hard for me to imagine being a store owner and not monitoring the interaction of the employees, even if I had to employ secret shoppers to test the employees.
Word of mouth spreads quickly, and a bad experience with one customer will probably result from him never coming back, potentially losing big bucks.
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Mac
Full Member
Posts: 834
First Name: John
Favorite Pipe: Ken Barnes Canted Billiard
Favorite Tobacco: Margate, Smyrna, Vintage Syrian
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Post by Mac on Jan 15, 2019 17:25:11 GMT -5
Well, once tobacco is banned from being sold online you’ll be seeing some new B&M’s back in business..........JMHO........it’s inevitable. Your basic tin tobacco’s that sells online now for around $10.00 will be selling for $21.95.......another good reason to build a good size cellar for your future. My bolding. I read this statement before and asked the poster (I think it may have been trailboss) more info about the statement as he said the FDA was trending that way. I'd really like to know if there's a basis for the FDA taking that stance. And B+Ms Some good ones in my area. And otherwise/elsewhere, there are good, bad and indifferent ones. So, certainly some "deserve" to survive, even thrive. |
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Post by trailboss on Jan 15, 2019 17:25:58 GMT -5
Edwards Pipe and cigar shop in Los Altos is another good one Martin, small but when I visited them they were friendly... they have a sister shop in San Jose I have heard good things about.
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Post by Dramatwist on Jan 15, 2019 17:29:49 GMT -5
My local Stag Tobacconist is one of the good ones. They are 60% cigars and 40% pipes/pipe tobacco. They know pipes and pipe tobacco and are happy to talk to you about it. They are also happy to work with new pipe smokers and educate them on how to smoke a pipe. 🙂 ...consider yourself lucky... |
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Post by Dramatwist on Jan 15, 2019 17:33:09 GMT -5
Edwards Pipe and cigar shop in Los Altos is another good one Martin, small but when I visited them they were friendly... they have a sister shop in San Jose I have heard good things about. Yes, Charlie, I have been to Edwards... Marty Pulvers frequents the place, one of my favorite pipe guys... but the problem in the Bay Area now is that it takes two to three hours to get from, say, Oakland to San Jose. It's ridiculous. |
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Post by trailboss on Jan 15, 2019 17:34:47 GMT -5
Well, once tobacco is banned from being sold online you’ll be seeing some new B&M’s back in business..........JMHO........it’s inevitable. Your basic tin tobacco’s that sells online now for around $10.00 will be selling for $21.95.......another good reason to build a good size cellar for your future. My bolding. I read this statement before and asked the poster (I think it may have been trailboss) more info about the statement as he said the FDA was trending that way. I'd really like to know if there's a basis for the FDA taking that stance. And B+Ms Some good ones in my area. And otherwise/elsewhere, there are good, bad and indifferent ones. So, certainly some "deserve" to survive, even thrive. I have no proof that is going to happen, but Washington stopped online purchases for their residents, and Utah followed suit. I have lived long enough to see these bad trends take place, and I won’t be surprised to see it happening. Our pipe club is communicating with the owner on the blends that we would like to see on the shelves, and he is working on getting the hard to get stuff that typically sells out in hours online, if not minutes. That helps us in the near future in being able to get the hard to gets, and in the event online purchases go away, we will be in a great position to have already laid the groundwork by having a relationship with a local tobacconist that has a customer base in place. |
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Post by Pistol Pete 1911 on Jan 15, 2019 17:36:02 GMT -5
I think anyone who wants to should be able to own a shop with a limited selection and crappy help to boot, but you or I don't have to shop there
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Post by trailboss on Jan 15, 2019 17:39:58 GMT -5
I might have said in another thread that the FDA was trending towards getting rid of online sales, probably more of a threat is state legislatures. It is easy for me to blame the FDA for everything negative relating to our hobby.  |
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Mac
Full Member
Posts: 834
First Name: John
Favorite Pipe: Ken Barnes Canted Billiard
Favorite Tobacco: Margate, Smyrna, Vintage Syrian
Location:
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Post by Mac on Jan 15, 2019 18:21:57 GMT -5
I might have said in another thread that the FDA was trending towards getting rid of online sales, probably more of a threat is state legislatures. It is easy for me to blame the FDA for everything negative relating to our hobby. Whew. It's bad enough what they've already done, but way worse would be the elimination of online sales. And that after they've helped squeeze out the few remaining B+Ms. |
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Post by simnettpratt on Jan 15, 2019 18:35:53 GMT -5
My B&M is fantastic and deserves to grow, not just survive. Tobacco Cabana, one proprietor Jim, and he's very knowledgable about pipes. Most of the store is filled with estates and he'll show you every one, though you already said you just came in for tobacco. He does sell cigars, but the only tobacco blends he sells are his own, and he knows what he's doing. All prices come to the nearest dollar and tax is included: five bucks for a five buck item and no digging out the 41¢.
For you new guys, one time he left to get a haircut and left the dog in charge. As in, he left the dog in charge: when he got back, he had a bunch of little notes, I took two ounces of this, two ounces of that, here's a twenty. Said they made change in the change drawer and eveything.
It was good to see him move a couple of doors down so he could expand, and now has a club lounge. Big leather chairs, bigscreen TV, and for your monthly fee you get your own locker for the booze.
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Post by kbareit on Jan 15, 2019 18:52:35 GMT -5
I found another cigar B&M that I stopped at since I was down the street from so I took a chance and found a nice selection of Peterson tins and CAO.They have Sutliff bulks bagged in one once bags. The owner was there and was helpful and admitted he didn't know much about pipe tobacco but if there was something I wanted just ask and he'd get it for me. His tins were reasonable at $13.00 but his Sutliff was a little high at $6.50 an ounce. He invited me to kick back and smoke a bowl in the lounge and have some coffee. Was a real nice guy and I left with 3 tins of Petersons and a tin of CAO and 2 oz. of Sutliff. I will be back at this B&M. Out of 5 that I have been to I have 2 good ones so I guess I'm doing alright.
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Post by scrooge on Jan 15, 2019 18:55:57 GMT -5
YES!!
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Post by pepesdad1 on Jan 15, 2019 19:04:09 GMT -5
Tallahassee used to have a B&M...now they have a small cigar store with three (3) tins (50grm) all starting at $35.00 and up. That pretty much left me cold, actually, being old I'm always cold...but the attitude from the owners was..."I can't help you unless you are buying cigars"...and that was through a thick accent that I was barely able to understand what he was saying. It was English, I think, but I'm not sure. Buying tobacco in Florida is a loosing game...with 85% tax markup...I don't waste time or gas to go to a shop with 3 tins and a tin cost that is outrageous.
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Post by Butch Cassidy on Jan 15, 2019 19:10:53 GMT -5
We have one here in Norwalk Ct....It's loaded with junk and the kid that works there is a dope.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2019 21:40:53 GMT -5
I'm working with my B&M to bring in pipe tobacco. Trying to narrow the initial offering to things we know the patrons will buy. I did this once for another shop and they decided to go online and do very little in the shop. Hopefully the area piper's will support the effort.
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Post by qmechanics on Jan 15, 2019 22:07:53 GMT -5
I have a pretty good B&M about an hour away in Topeka called Churchills. They have a nice selection of pipes, decent in store blends and a knowledgeable staff. The only thing they lack is a variety of tins.
PS I also had the pleasure of visiting the "famous" B&M Just for Him on a trip to the Ozarks. It was an odd but nice shop with a large stock of pipe tobaccos (5-6 hours away from me😞).
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2019 22:12:39 GMT -5
Edwards Pipe and cigar shop in Los Altos is another good one Martin, small but when I visited them they were friendly... they have a sister shop in San Jose I have heard good things about. Edwards Pipe & Tobacco Shop in Englewood, Colorado has a great selection of pipe tobaccos as well as a helpful and knowledgeable owner and staff. The decor is nice too. There's also a good shop in Colorado Springs, but I haven't been there and don't recall its name. |
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