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Post by Deleted on Mar 10, 2018 22:36:13 GMT -5
Looking for some reasons on why cigars have taken over the tobacco market. When I was young it seemed to me to be pretty well split.
These are observations/opinions that I would like some input on
Are cigars more popular because they are seen as a power smoke among movers and shakers? My older brother tells me at some of the get togethers of the mucketymucks that it's always the big cigar that gets pulled out. My oldest daughter's first husband was a major consultant. Lu told me she had a Cuban cigar waiting for me on my next trip, only to tell me she got too tempted and smoked it. huh?
Will pipes ever regain dominance before all tobacco is vaporized by the dogooders?
If anyone has looked at online supplies at SPC and P&C they might notice that they are out of more products now than ever before. Will these runs on tobacco by the carpetbaggers ruin it for all? 425$ for a pouch of Balkan Sobraine. Will we eventually have to go to the black market even for CH?
In Orwell's 1984 (doing this from memory) Winston Smith had to drink stuff that was passed off as coffee, but only "The Party" got the real coffee and real sugar. Coming to a world near you?
Will Deeming be the final crunch on tobacco? Will there be more "Deemings" to come? Or, will society actually loosen up at some point, like they did with Absinthe, back by popular demand?
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Post by slowroll on Mar 10, 2018 23:12:58 GMT -5
Cigars probably more popular because they're more convenient. That s the only reason I smoked 'em for so long, and a couple other guys I know. As for the other observations, kee-rist only knows what the anti everything Nazis will try to accomplish. Different persuasion they have these days, but the old definition of a Puritan applies -- "...someone who is afraid that somewhere, some place, someone else is having fun."
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Post by PhantomWolf on Mar 10, 2018 23:25:26 GMT -5
I think SlowRoll is on to something with the convenience. Also, Pipes are way more of a commitment. And pipes have a very old time quality to them. Kind of like certain styles of hat- not everyone can pull it off without looking like a pretentious hipster. So my vote is that the current social paradigm favours cigars, though it seems like tobacco smoking as a whole is waning.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 10, 2018 23:47:52 GMT -5
From my prospective (53 year old American man): When I was a kid ('70s), grandfathers and dad's smoked pipes, cigars, or cigarettes, but cigarettes were the most popular form of tobacco. When I was in high school, athletes chewed tobacco and almost no students smoked cigarettes. In college (mid-'80s), clove cigarettes were popular. After college ('90s), premium cigars became trendy (cigar bars, etc) and have remained popular with folks who really enjoyed them. Around ten years ago, pipe smoking became trendy with some college students and vaping with others.
Tobacco has historically been feared (His face is on fire! or He's a demon from hell!), embraced, banned (including a number of states in the USA), become common place, been over used, condemned, and made anathema. However, it has never entirely died out and, in my opinion, never will. Anti-tobacco forces have always been around and have been intermittently successful, only to be followed by a boomerang resurgence. We are currently in a very anti-tobacco environment in the west. In my opinion, we're due for a boomerang, but things are likely to get much worse before they get better. YMMV!
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Post by cigrmaster on Mar 10, 2018 23:48:11 GMT -5
Cigars are more popular because any moron can smoke them. There is no learning curve like there is with pipes. You can also smoke cigars on the golf course where as pipes would be too much of a pain. I smoked cigars for over 20 years and I have no regrets giving them up. I get more flavor from my pipes than I did with my cigars.
I believe the interest in pipes for the younger generation is the cost factor. You can buy a tin of great tobacco for around 10 bucks and get a dozen or so smokes from it. A good cigar will cost 5-10 for one smoke that lasts an hour. You can get a 4 gram bowl of flake tobacco to easily smoke for 2 hours.
Unfortunately the anti smoking crowd will continue to try and take our tobacco away in one way or another. I predict in 20 years we will see a huge black market much like the drug trade, and we will have a war on tobacco.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 10, 2018 23:49:17 GMT -5
I see your points and raise this: A guy in a 5K suit looks like a professor with a pipe. With a cigar he looks like he's out to conquer the world. When my older bro hits one of those meetings he will smoke a cigar. We grew up smoking pipes and he won't touch them since he quit smoking on a regular basis.
Cigars need an ashtray. Pipes do not. So, though I see your convenience point, I am not totally buying into it.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 10, 2018 23:54:54 GMT -5
@walkman cigrmaster our posts all hit at the same time. I think both of you have a lot of the pieces of the puzzle. I didn't name all my thoughts, but flavor was one of them. I could be as happy with a Swisher Sweet or Black Jack as I could a more expensive stogie. With pipes I have a lot of flavors to choose from. Price is a big issue, as you stated. Trendiness is too, which is a younger thing that often leads to how we act later. I think a cigar makes someone look like an Alpha Male and that is what a lot shoot for. Pipes do not make you Beta, but they just don't look Alpha |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 11, 2018 0:26:18 GMT -5
I think a cigar makes someone look like an Alpha Male and that is what a lot shoot for. Pipes do not make you Beta, but they just don't look Alpha Hi David, I think all points made thus far are valid. I agree that in general, cigar smokers are seen as powerful, wealthy, alpha male; while pipe smokers are typically seen as wise, intelligent, fatherly; and cigarette smokers are cool, bad, tough, and dangerous. These are of course stereotypes, but are often what people aspire to when they decide to smoke. How each are perceived varies by generation and location as well, so others may disagree. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 11, 2018 0:28:35 GMT -5
yes, a little more complex than I gave it thought. Generations tied with trends. I keep waiting for spats and Kentucky Bow Ties to come back in fashion.
Edit - Forgot to mention Knickers, Raccoon Coats, and Ukes
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Post by cigrmaster on Mar 11, 2018 0:46:27 GMT -5
Back in my days in the car business, when we would get any type of engineer, who would analyze every little detail we would call them pipe smokers. The connotation meaning that pipe smokers were thoughtful and never rushed decisions. We considered them to be a pain in the arse, who we were rarely ever able to screw over. Walk into any car dealer and ask them what type of customer is a pipe smoker. I wonder if the term is still used. I am going back to the mid 80's.
This was during my cigar smoking years and I had not yet picked up the pipe. It was great being able to smoke my cigars inside the dealership.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 11, 2018 1:02:03 GMT -5
Back in my days in the car business, when we would get any type of engineer, who would analyze every little detail we would call them pipe smokers. The connotation meaning that pipe smokers were thoughtful and never rushed decisions. We considered them to be a pain in the arse, who we were rarely ever able to screw over. Walk into any car dealer and ask them what type of customer is a pipe smoker. I wonder if the term is still used. I am going back to the mid 80's. This was during my cigar smoking years and I had not yet picked up the pipe. It was great being able to smoke my cigars inside the dealership. LOL. That's great. I'm an engineer and know for a fact that I have always been a pain in the posterior whenever I have bought a car.  |
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Post by trailboss on Mar 11, 2018 1:03:54 GMT -5
Some great observations made that I cannot improve upon by adding my two cents..but, I am glad that there are so many cigar smokers, had they not had a resurgence in popularity over the last few decades, we would have a lot less cigar shops that are willing to carry our blends and pipes as a sideline.
We had our pipe club meeting in a great smoking lounge, the only reason it exists is because the cigar smokers pay the freight, we contribute to the till, but far less.
Edit:
Just to add, for every cigar smoker there is one less person that looks down on our hobby as detestable... they may think we are odd though.😉
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Post by Deleted on Mar 11, 2018 1:08:57 GMT -5
Some great observations made that I cannot improve upon by adding my two cents..but, I am glad that there are so many cigar smokers, had they not had a resurgence in popularity over the last few decades, we would have a lot less cigar shops that are willing to carry our blends and pipes as a sideline. We had our pipe club meeting in a great smoking lounge, the only reason it exists is because the cigar smokers pay the freight, we contribute to the till, but far less. I couldn't agree more, Trailboss. |
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Post by zambini on Mar 11, 2018 3:07:58 GMT -5
Hispanics are also a bigger presence in the US than before and they come from families where cigars were far more common than pipes.
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Post by Darin on Mar 11, 2018 8:54:55 GMT -5
To me, it's not a "vs" situation. I like them both for different reasons at different times. Also, since I roll my own and usually don't even put on a wrapper, it's not about prestige. Lol
Cigars provide flavors you'll never get from a pipe and vicey-versey.
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Post by mwps70 on Mar 11, 2018 9:13:03 GMT -5
A lot of good points here. I know that as soon as my son and his friends turned 18 they started to go to our local B&M on the weekends to pick up a good cigar. They asked me for advice but honestly I am not sure what attracted them to cigars. It is nice that I get to share a cigar smoking experience with my son. I am hoping some day to buy him a pipe and introduce him to the hobby. I did call our local B&M once to see about setting up a monthly pipe meet up and was met with nothing but negativity. "Pipe smokers don't spend any money. They bring their tobaccos, share them and don't spend any money." Coming from a B&M with literally 4 tins of Drew Estate pipe tobacco and 3 tins of John Cotton. No bulk. Get some bulk and start carrying some additional tinned tobacco and maybe they would get some business. Speaking of, I bet that tin of Gatsby Flake there has three years age on it...hmmm  |
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Post by Baboo on Mar 11, 2018 9:35:31 GMT -5
I very often roll my pipe Tobaccos in extra large cig papers for long tasty smokes that never need a relight... hence, best of both worlds - pipe tobacco cigars!
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Post by cgvt on Mar 11, 2018 11:15:11 GMT -5
Back in my days in the car business, when we would get any type of engineer, who would analyze every little detail we would call them pipe smokers. The connotation meaning that pipe smokers were thoughtful and never rushed decisions. We considered them to be a pain in the arse, who we were rarely ever able to screw over. Walk into any car dealer and ask them what type of customer is a pipe smoker. I wonder if the term is still used. I am going back to the mid 80's. This was during my cigar smoking years and I had not yet picked up the pipe. It was great being able to smoke my cigars inside the dealership. I worked in a car dealership back in the early 80s. Sold cars for a very short time (sold very few) and the old time salesmen would avoid pipe smokers like the plague and always give them to the young new guy (me). I didn't sell enough cars to form an opinion, but "the pipe smoker is a pain in the arse" was a prevalent belief then. Maybe not now, because you can't walk into a dealership smoking a pipe any more. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 11, 2018 12:28:33 GMT -5
zambini Excellent point that also adds ethnicity to generations and trends @darin caught the "vs", but I wanted to show how modern I am. The "Trendies" always use "V" these days. Rolling your cigars without a wrapper? I need to start searching YouTube more
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Post by Darin on Mar 11, 2018 13:48:19 GMT -5
The dress (wrapper) makes her look pretty ... but it is what's inside that really counts. 
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Post by Deleted on Mar 11, 2018 13:59:57 GMT -5
I just looked up wrappers online. I doubt, with my shaky hands, that I could do it without a wrapper, but it sounds like something I want to try
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Post by Darin on Mar 11, 2018 15:07:01 GMT -5
I just looked up wrappers online. I doubt, with my shaky hands, that I could do it without a wrapper, but it sounds like something I want to try
The filler tobacco goes in a binder leaf (I use a double binder, 2 leaves) and then it's pressed. At that point, it's not super pretty but can certainly be smoked. Unless it's a smaller ring gauge and a thick (like Maduro) wrapper, it just doesn't really add enough flavor to justify the cost.
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Post by Ronv69 on Mar 12, 2018 8:57:02 GMT -5
I have always remembered what some actress said in my youth, that cigar smokers had an oral fetish, and not a good one. Hence I smoke my cigars in private.
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Post by Dramatwist on Mar 12, 2018 14:00:58 GMT -5
...I wish I liked cigars because they're a great prop, but there's no flavor in them according to my palate.
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Post by crapgame on Mar 12, 2018 18:39:17 GMT -5
Intimidation is easier with a cigar, hold the cigar with fingers and poke someone with the hand holding the cigar.. can't do that with a pipe.. maybe poke with the stem but the stem may break and no intimidation factor getting piled with a pipe stem.. that's my two bits.
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Post by Scott W on Mar 12, 2018 18:44:34 GMT -5
I love both but I really enjoy pipes as they are more thoughtful and require less time. I don’t always have an hour to sit and smoke a cigar in it’s entirety
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Post by Deleted on Mar 12, 2018 18:54:52 GMT -5
...I wish I liked cigars because they're a great prop, but there's no flavor in them according to my palate. I know what you mean, but I'd say there's one basic flavor. As different as Cuban, Dominican, Nicaraguan etc. are, they all have the same basic flavor profile. This is in total contrast to wide variations between, say, OGS, Margate, and Molto Dolce. So I guess I've just explained why I smoke pipes so much more often than cigars. |
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Post by Ronv69 on Mar 17, 2018 11:18:16 GMT -5
I just found out that I like Principes Palmas, rum and chocolate flavors. It was a gift. I used to like some long, slim Macanudos, but I outgrew it.
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Post by Legend Lover on Mar 17, 2018 17:36:42 GMT -5
I find cigars far too strong for me. I like the fact that you can alter the 'strength' of the pipe depending on the tobacco used.
Since I started piping I've had one cigar - a Romeo & Julietta...I got 1/4 of the way down and binned it.
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Post by exchef on Mar 17, 2018 19:56:30 GMT -5
I find cigars far too strong for me. I like the fact that you can alter the 'strength' of the pipe depending on the tobacco used. Since I started piping I've had one cigar - a Romeo & Julietta...I got 1/4 of the way down and binned it. If you are looking for a good mild body cigar, check out the Ashton line: ashtoncigar.com/cigars/ashton-cigars/ashtonAnother good mild bodied cigar would be www.macanudo.com/cigars/macanudo-gold-label/There are several mild AVOs as well. ExChef |
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