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Post by AJ on Oct 27, 2018 14:29:03 GMT -5
These words are very similar in meaning but there are differences. Some Sage in the past said if a man could concentrate on one subject exclusively for two minutes he could rule the world. I think he’s on to something. Trying to concentrate on just one subject for two minutes without allowing thoughts about other matters to enter your thoughts may be impossible. Give it a try.
Contemplation is thoughtful observation possibly with full and deep considerations, reflections. For example, We do this when we attempt to interpret someone’s words, written or spoken. “I wonder what they meant by that?”
Meditation is continued or extended thought, reflection, contemplation. Meditation takes concentration and contemplation to the next level and it consumes much more of one’s time.
Pipe smoking lends itself to all three. It’s a matter of degrees and time. Pipe smokers are known to be meditators but I wonder if most of us aren’t really concentrators or those who contemplate? I feel meditation requires a certain amount of dedication. One must allow themselves the time to meditate. I’m not sure how long one should dedicate to thought if it is to be called meditating. Is it defined by the length of our smoking session? What are your thoughts about this? How did you arrive at your answer? Did you Concentrate, Contemplate, or Meditate? Were you smoking your pipe when giving these questions consideration?
AJ
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Post by kxg on Oct 27, 2018 14:46:00 GMT -5
Interesting topic. I've some difficulty with concentration. I am capable of it given the optimal circumstance, but normally my mind flits about; perhaps I've a touch of ADD and have for a good long while, way before it became popular.
I've been a contemplative smoker for years, formerly with a cigar on the patio in the evening, gazing at a clear sky. This allowed me time to reflect on many things and I find the practice to be enjoyable with a pipe.
For me, meditation is a different practice. Where concentration is focus on a single thought or task, and contemplation is a longer, deeper reflection on a broader range of thought, meditation is more an exercise of clearing the mind; an emptying, if you will. Meditation also seems to require a quieting of the body, paying attention to breathing, etc. Of the three, meditation is the more difficult for me as I usually have a lot running around in my head. But, done well, meditation can be quite restorative. I'm not sure that smoking, or much of any other "activity", is conducive to meditation; but that's just me.
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Post by pepesdad1 on Oct 27, 2018 14:55:08 GMT -5
Concentration, Contemplation, and Meditation.
Concentration is hard for me..meds keep my mind in flux...Contemplation is a matter of...should I head for the bathroom or not? Hmmm.
Meditation is something I do whilst on the proverbial throne...then it is back to concentration...did I wipe or didn't I?
That's the best I can do.
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Post by AJ on Oct 27, 2018 14:57:45 GMT -5
An interesting viewpoint Kelly. Thanks for the reply.
OK you guys/gals, let’s hear your thoughts.
AJ
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Post by kxg on Oct 27, 2018 15:00:02 GMT -5
It seems that Walt and I agree on meditation...in a strange sort of way.
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Post by AJ on Oct 27, 2018 15:01:52 GMT -5
Concentration, Contemplation, and Meditation. Concentration is hard for me..meds keep my mind in flux...Contemplation is a matter of...should I head for the bathroom or not? Hmmm. Meditation is something I do whilst on the proverbial throne...then it is back to concentration...did I wipe or didn't I? That's the best I can do.  Attaboy Walt, that’s keeping reality in focus especially for us old geezers. AJ |
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Post by puffy on Oct 27, 2018 15:04:40 GMT -5
I don't know where this fits.My thoughts wander from one thing to another pretty often.(Like every few seconds) I've never been able to keep my body still for long periods of time..My mind either..I guess Meditation is definitely out.
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Post by AJ on Oct 27, 2018 15:23:13 GMT -5
Thanks Larry. I think a lot of us have a similar difficulty.
AJ
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2018 15:27:15 GMT -5
With all that’s been going on with my health and now my daughter, I no longer contemplate. What needs to get done with treatments, tests and medications is a must.....no contemplation needed.......it will be a long journey.
Meditation, as often as possible. Especially at night when I light a candle. For me I find it helps lower my stress level and prepares me for what’s ahead. Meditation and Prayer together is what helps me cope with the long road that's inevitable.
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Post by clintonvilleleather on Oct 27, 2018 15:30:27 GMT -5
I spent a lot of time in concentration this week doing a complicated braiding pattern on a customers belt. Just finished up while puffing on some conniston cut plug in a cob. A complex task which requires complete focus can feel like an exercise in meditation. Contemplating is usually what I do when I am getting hungry!
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Post by AJ on Oct 27, 2018 18:26:01 GMT -5
Ted, I’m acquainted with the stress your facing with your daughter’s illness as well as your own health problems. Prayers for you both are being offered daily.
“Contemplating is usually what I do when I am getting hungry!” 😊
AJ
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Post by pepesdad1 on Oct 27, 2018 18:31:59 GMT -5
Ted, I’m acquainted with the stress your facing with your daughter’s illness as well as your own health problems. Prayers for you both are being offered daily.“Contemplating is usually what I do when I am getting hungry!” 😊
AJ
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Post by roadsdiverged on Oct 27, 2018 18:54:58 GMT -5
Concentration has eluded me for the last year or so. Busy life, busy mind.
Contemplation comes everytime I light a pipe. I sit and think about anything and everything.
I've been meditating a few times a week for the last few months. When I chose to have a sober life in June of 2017 I knew I had to make some changes in myself. It took me many months to learn how to turn everything off and just disappear into my inner being. I can find peace there and that's exactly what I needed. Sometimes it's hard to get to that point but it is possible.
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Post by pepesdad1 on Oct 27, 2018 19:11:14 GMT -5
Concentration has eluded me for the last year or so. Busy life, busy mind. Contemplation comes everytime I light a pipe. I sit and think about anything and everything. I've been meditating a few times a week for the last few months. When I chose to have a sober life in June of 2017 I knew I had to make some changes in myself. It took me many months to learn how to turn everything off and just disappear into my inner being. I can find peace there and that's exactly what I needed. Sometimes it's hard to get to that point but it is possible....and that is 'bout all you need to do. Finding peace is something we all try to do...when you find it...WOW. |
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Post by peterd-Buffalo Spirit on Oct 27, 2018 20:07:57 GMT -5
… an interesting topic....I'll have to think about an appropriate response...
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2018 20:59:27 GMT -5
Ted, I’m acquainted with the stress your facing with your daughter’s illness as well as your own health problems. Prayers for you both are being offered daily. “ Contemplating is usually what I do when I am getting hungry!” 😊
AJ |
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Post by Screaming Jazz on Oct 27, 2018 21:39:33 GMT -5
While smoking my pipe is often relaxing and a nice practice in patience and cadence, I don't find it to be meditative. Personally, I associate a certain body feeling and mindset with meditation. When I meditate my goal is to have my brain running on alpha waves. I try to ride the line between sleep and awake. I get a slight dissociated feeling and my body relaxes. To meditate like this I need to be doing nothing. Having to be consciously aware of my what I'm tasting won't allow me to enter this mindset. But I think you're talking about a different kind of meditation. Yours is a much more simple version of meditating(not that that's bad!) From what it sounds like your goal isn't to put yourself in a trance. My way of meditating is just a different way to reach the same goal of deep thought.
Meditation has done wonder for me in the past. Once while I was traveling abroad with a friend he got blackout drunk and caused me some trouble. Upon returning to the hotel room I was fuming mad at him. I decided I couldn't carry this anger as it only hurts me. I sat on my bed and began to meditate. I meditated for only about 15 minutes, but it felt like less than 1 minutes. When I came out I was almost anger free. I was relaxed and happy that at least no one was hurt and the trouble was over. It was an amazing experience.
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Screaming Jazz
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Post by Screaming Jazz on Oct 27, 2018 21:46:05 GMT -5
Concentration has eluded me for the last year or so. Busy life, busy mind. Contemplation comes everytime I light a pipe. I sit and think about anything and everything. I've been meditating a few times a week for the last few months. When I chose to have a sober life in June of 2017 I knew I had to make some changes in myself. It took me many months to learn how to turn everything off and just disappear into my inner being. I can find peace there and that's exactly what I needed. Sometimes it's hard to get to that point but it is possible. Congratulations on the sobriety. As I go about my day I think about anything and everything as well. My mind leaps from thought island to thought island. Concentration can be hard for sure. It requires me to set up camp on just one island and stay there for a while. It takes a lot of conscious effort. |
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Post by Legend Lover on Oct 28, 2018 5:01:22 GMT -5
Concentration is difficult for me. My mind wanders everywhere. I can rarely hold on to 1 thought for more than a few seconds.
Meditation is also difficult for the same reason.
For me, contemplation works, and happens when I smoke my pipe. For me, contemplation is when I start off with a thought, but my mind takes a journey around that thought, coming back to it, but looking at it from different angles. My mind has free reign to wander and I encourage it to. The end result is more complete and fulfilled.
It's how I get my ideas.
I also talk to myself in my head.
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Post by morallynomadic on Oct 28, 2018 7:00:12 GMT -5
I am hesitant to call myself a Taoist as I think that labeling things tends to muddy the waters. However, for conversation's sake let's do so here.
As a Taoist, I have to say that the rigidity people place on meditation is part of what makes meditation so difficult for people. It's not magic and we all do it some degree from time to time.
There are lots of ways to meditate. It can be for five seconds, five minutes, or five hours. If you've ever been driving or walking somewhere and zoned out a little, only realizing it after some time has passed and you don't remember the details of part of your trip very well, congratulations, you've been meditating.
Meditation is something I do multiple times a day, even if I only get thirty seconds or so. As for meditation while smoking a pipe, that doesn't happen too much and when it does, it isn't really aided by the pipe at all. That isn't to say that you couldn't create a meditative state through smoking, you can do that with anything from breathing, hugging, to driving, it's just not part of my practice.
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Post by pepesdad1 on Oct 28, 2018 7:02:50 GMT -5
Concentration is difficult for me. My mind wanders everywhere. I can rarely hold on to 1 thought for more than a few seconds. Meditation is also difficult for the same reason. For me, contemplation works, and happens when I smoke my pipe. For me, contemplation is when I start off with a thought, but my mind takes a journey around that thought, coming back to it, but looking at it from different angles. My mind has free reign to wander and I encourage it to. The end result is more complete and fulfilled. It's how I get my ideas. I also talk to myself in my head. Morning Paddy, and here I thought I was going or was nutz...when I was younger. Didn't have anyone that I could talk to about it...carried those thoughts for many years...until I got in college studying Psychology...then I knew I was nutz. |
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Post by Legend Lover on Oct 28, 2018 8:15:16 GMT -5
Concentration is difficult for me. My mind wanders everywhere. I can rarely hold on to 1 thought for more than a few seconds. Meditation is also difficult for the same reason. For me, contemplation works, and happens when I smoke my pipe. For me, contemplation is when I start off with a thought, but my mind takes a journey around that thought, coming back to it, but looking at it from different angles. My mind has free reign to wander and I encourage it to. The end result is more complete and fulfilled. It's how I get my ideas. I also talk to myself in my head. Morning Paddy, and here I thought I was going or was nutz...when I was younger. Didn't have anyone that I could talk to about it...carried those thoughts for many years...until I got in college studying Psychology...then I knew I was nutz. Morning pepesdad1 (well, afternoon). We can be nuts together. |
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Post by Dramatwist on Oct 28, 2018 8:55:36 GMT -5
Contemplation, as I practice it, is focusing on a particular topic for more than a few minutes in an attempt to see the subject from every possible viewpoint. Meditation is something I use to "settle down" my consciousness. Concentration, for me, is usually an activity, such as playing a musical instrument. YMMV.
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Post by Cramptholomew on Oct 28, 2018 9:24:06 GMT -5
Concentration is difficult for me. My mind wanders everywhere. I can rarely hold on to 1 thought for more than a few seconds. Meditation is also difficult for the same reason. For me, contemplation works, and happens when I smoke my pipe. For me, contemplation is when I start off with a thought, but my mind takes a journey around that thought, coming back to it, but looking at it from different angles. My mind has free reign to wander and I encourage it to. The end result is more complete and fulfilled. It's how I get my ideas. I also talk to myself in my head. Hello me! It's me! |
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Post by pepesdad1 on Oct 28, 2018 9:31:24 GMT -5
Concentration is difficult for me. My mind wanders everywhere. I can rarely hold on to 1 thought for more than a few seconds. Meditation is also difficult for the same reason. For me, contemplation works, and happens when I smoke my pipe. For me, contemplation is when I start off with a thought, but my mind takes a journey around that thought, coming back to it, but looking at it from different angles. My mind has free reign to wander and I encourage it to. The end result is more complete and fulfilled. It's how I get my ideas. I also talk to myself in my head. Pretty much the way it goes^^^^^. |
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Post by Dramatwist on Oct 28, 2018 9:31:36 GMT -5
Concentration is difficult for me. My mind wanders everywhere. I can rarely hold on to 1 thought for more than a few seconds. Meditation is also difficult for the same reason. For me, contemplation works, and happens when I smoke my pipe. For me, contemplation is when I start off with a thought, but my mind takes a journey around that thought, coming back to it, but looking at it from different angles. My mind has free reign to wander and I encourage it to. The end result is more complete and fulfilled. It's how I get my ideas. I also talk to myself in my head. ...we all "talk to ourselves in our heads"... it's referred to as "the internal dialogue"... |
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Post by Cramptholomew on Oct 28, 2018 9:45:35 GMT -5
Concentration, for me, is usually an activity, such as playing a musical instrument. YMMV. This is true for me, too. When I start building something from scratch, I'm singularly focused on that task. I can't say it's necessarily relaxing, since my goal is to perfect what I'm doing. I lean toward ADD, and concentrating puts my brain into a different mode than what I'm used to. A fear of failure of that task can almost be anxiety inducing. I am NOT good at quiet meditation, because, like Legend Lover, my mind insists on wandering on tangential paths. I wish I could get into some peaceful meditation, and liquidate my thoughts, but I think the effort trying to accomplish that is counterintuitive to what meditation actually is. Contemplation comes easier, since my mind likes to run scenarios by default. So, looking at something from different angles is almost natural. |
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Screaming Jazz
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Post by Screaming Jazz on Oct 28, 2018 11:06:09 GMT -5
I am hesitant to call myself a Taoist as I think that labeling things tends to muddy the waters. However, for conversation's sake let's do so here. As a Taoist, I have to say that the rigidity people place on meditation is part of what makes meditation so difficult for people. It's not magic and we all do it some degree from time to time. There are lots of ways to meditate. It can be for five seconds, five minutes, or five hours. If you've ever been driving or walking somewhere and zoned out a little, only realizing it after some time has passed and you don't remember the details of part of your trip very well, congratulations, you've been meditating. Meditation is something I do multiple times a day, even if I only get thirty seconds or so. As for meditation while smoking a pipe, that doesn't happen too much and when it does, it isn't really aided by the pipe at all. That isn't to say that you couldn't create a meditative state through smoking, you can do that with anything from breathing, hugging, to driving, it's just not part of my practice. what I do to meditate is what works for me. I definitely agree that not everyone has to do it my way. What ever works for you is what works for you. |
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Post by slowroll on Oct 28, 2018 13:16:30 GMT -5
As an old engineer by training and trade, I can concentrate on a technical problem for long periods, and am happiest doing so. As far as meditating, I leave that to philosophers.  |
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Post by Dramatwist on Oct 28, 2018 13:24:07 GMT -5
As an old engineer by training and trade, I can concentrate on a technical problem for long periods, and am happiest doing so. As far as meditating, I leave that to philosophers. ...all three are a matter of directing attention in one way or another... IMHO... |
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