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Post by sperrytops on Sept 14, 2022 20:44:05 GMT -5
Cal passed a law banning gas vehicle sales by 2035. It acknowledges a significant increase in grid capacity is required to support this and they are laying out plans to meet the demand. How, I cannot say, but they have a few years to figure it out. And they will, people are smart. You do know that you have to drive an electric car 400,000 miles to break even on carbon emissions with a gasoline car, don't you? The rest of the country doesn't think of California as smart generally. My personal experience with LA denizens is that they are the absolute dumbest people I have ever met. With all the people moving to Texas we're the ones who have to build up the grid, while the load on the California grid will make it unnecessary. That depends on regional sources. All-electric vehicles and PHEVs running only on electricity have zero tailpipe emissions, but emissions may be produced by the source of electrical power, such as a power plant. In geographic areas that use relatively low-polluting energy sources for electricity generation, all-electric vehicles and PHEVs typically have lower emissions well-to-wheel than similar conventional vehicles running on gasoline or diesel. In regions that depend heavily on coal for electricity generation, EVs may not demonstrate a strong well-to-wheel emissions benefit. |
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Post by Ronv69 on Sept 14, 2022 21:32:10 GMT -5
I Googled oil company bailouts, and it appears that indeed in 2020 it was an issue. I admit that I was unaware of it. I don’t think any company or industry deserves bailouts, just like the banks, bailing out companies prevents the market from making necessary corrections. I have been in tough spots, never filed bankruptcy, never was bailed out. While I agree with you in principle; the world governments have sadly allowed us to become too dependent on certain industries, energy and banking being the biggest. If they collapse we see a depression that makes the great one look mild. Once again, where do you think we would be without the energy companies? |
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Post by Ronv69 on Sept 14, 2022 21:41:11 GMT -5
You do know that you have to drive an electric car 400,000 miles to break even on carbon emissions with a gasoline car, don't you? The rest of the country doesn't think of California as smart generally. My personal experience with LA denizens is that they are the absolute dumbest people I have ever met. With all the people moving to Texas we're the ones who have to build up the grid, while the load on the California grid will make it unnecessary. That depends on regional sources. All-electric vehicles and PHEVs running only on electricity have zero tailpipe emissions, but emissions may be produced by the source of electrical power, such as a power plant. In geographic areas that use relatively low-polluting energy sources for electricity generation, all-electric vehicles and PHEVs typically have lower emissions well-to-wheel than similar conventional vehicles running on gasoline or diesel. In regions that depend heavily on coal for electricity generation, EVs may not demonstrate a strong well-to-wheel emissions benefit. It's not even the generation of the energy. The manufacturing of the batteries accounts for most of the carbon footprint. On top of that they aren't going to last long enough to break even. 100k and they will need new batteries, putting them further behind. Most mining experts say there isn't enough lithium to build all the batteries. Refining the lithium is a filthy business too. I'm bummed that Musk is going to build a lithium processing plant in a formerly beautiful part of Texas. Hydrogen/electric cars are the future, but we're probably at least 10 years out on those. |
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Post by adui on Sept 14, 2022 22:43:08 GMT -5
I'm hoping the solid-state battery becomes a viable thing. What I read uses sodium, rather than lithium. Not 100% green but exponentially better than lithium and far cheaper in terms of raw material availability.
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Post by Legend Lover on Sept 15, 2022 3:07:42 GMT -5
That depends on regional sources. All-electric vehicles and PHEVs running only on electricity have zero tailpipe emissions, but emissions may be produced by the source of electrical power, such as a power plant. In geographic areas that use relatively low-polluting energy sources for electricity generation, all-electric vehicles and PHEVs typically have lower emissions well-to-wheel than similar conventional vehicles running on gasoline or diesel. In regions that depend heavily on coal for electricity generation, EVs may not demonstrate a strong well-to-wheel emissions benefit. It's not even the generation of the energy. The manufacturing of the batteries accounts for most of the carbon footprint. On top of that they aren't going to last long enough to break even. 100k and they will need new batteries, putting them further behind. Most mining experts say there isn't enough lithium to build all the batteries. Refining the lithium is a filthy business too. I'm bummed that Musk is going to build a lithium processing plant in a formerly beautiful part of Texas. Hydrogen/electric cars are the future, but we're probably at least 10 years out on those. Yep - if we could find a catalyst to speed up the conversion of water into hydrogen and oxygen, lowering the amount of energy needed to make that happen, we'd be on a winner. You could have a self-fuelling car. |
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Post by Plainsman on Sept 15, 2022 8:00:47 GMT -5
O, woe! Supply day. Been putting it off and can do that no longer. Gettin’ so I hate like sin going into town.
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Post by Ronv69 on Sept 15, 2022 9:57:08 GMT -5
It's not even the generation of the energy. The manufacturing of the batteries accounts for most of the carbon footprint. On top of that they aren't going to last long enough to break even. 100k and they will need new batteries, putting them further behind. Most mining experts say there isn't enough lithium to build all the batteries. Refining the lithium is a filthy business too. I'm bummed that Musk is going to build a lithium processing plant in a formerly beautiful part of Texas. Hydrogen/electric cars are the future, but we're probably at least 10 years out on those. Yep - if we could find a catalyst to speed up the conversion of water into hydrogen and oxygen, lowering the amount of energy needed to make that happen, we'd be on a winner. You could have a self-fuelling car. They have actually found several catalysts that they are testing that show a lot of promise. There are issues with scaling them up to production with things like accumulation of surface contaminates and such, but it looks like it can be overcome. Maybe someday we'll actually fulfill the dream of filling our cars with water. |
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Post by Ronv69 on Sept 15, 2022 9:58:21 GMT -5
O, woe! Supply day. Been putting it off and can do that no longer. Gettin’ so I hate like sin going into town. Yep, need to go into Atlanta today for the vet and grocery store. At least the traffic is light. |
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Post by sperrytops on Sept 15, 2022 10:44:38 GMT -5
While I agree with you in principle; the world governments have sadly allowed us to become too dependent on certain industries, energy and banking being the biggest. If they collapse we see a depression that makes the great one look mild. Once again, where do you think we would be without the energy companies? Frankly, I didn't say get rid of energy companies, I said I didn't like them. A necessary evil as they demonstrate little concern over the impact of cost increases. Particularly since they are probably the most heavily subsidized industry in the country. I believe that if we're pouring money into them, they should be paying it back to the feds. Otherwise they're just on the dole. |
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Post by sperrytops on Sept 15, 2022 10:51:41 GMT -5
That depends on regional sources. All-electric vehicles and PHEVs running only on electricity have zero tailpipe emissions, but emissions may be produced by the source of electrical power, such as a power plant. In geographic areas that use relatively low-polluting energy sources for electricity generation, all-electric vehicles and PHEVs typically have lower emissions well-to-wheel than similar conventional vehicles running on gasoline or diesel. In regions that depend heavily on coal for electricity generation, EVs may not demonstrate a strong well-to-wheel emissions benefit. It's not even the generation of the energy. The manufacturing of the batteries accounts for most of the carbon footprint. On top of that they aren't going to last long enough to break even. 100k and they will need new batteries, putting them further behind. Most mining experts say there isn't enough lithium to build all the batteries. Refining the lithium is a filthy business too. I'm bummed that Musk is going to build a lithium processing plant in a formerly beautiful part of Texas. Hydrogen/electric cars are the future, but we're probably at least 10 years out on those. Tesla factories are the most energy efficient out there and they plan to use almost entirely renewable energy for their new battery manufacturing. And Teslas battery farms could easily solve Texas power issues. |
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Post by Plainsman on Sept 15, 2022 10:55:47 GMT -5
EVs are neither popular nor practical out here. Distances are too long. I don’t know of a single one in the area.
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Post by sperrytops on Sept 15, 2022 10:55:49 GMT -5
I'm hoping the solid-state battery becomes a viable thing. What I read uses sodium, rather than lithium. Not 100% green but exponentially better than lithium and far cheaper in terms of raw material availability. As more and more money pours into alternative energy research, these options become more possible. |
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Post by Ronv69 on Sept 15, 2022 11:45:35 GMT -5
It's not even the generation of the energy. The manufacturing of the batteries accounts for most of the carbon footprint. On top of that they aren't going to last long enough to break even. 100k and they will need new batteries, putting them further behind. Most mining experts say there isn't enough lithium to build all the batteries. Refining the lithium is a filthy business too. I'm bummed that Musk is going to build a lithium processing plant in a formerly beautiful part of Texas. Hydrogen/electric cars are the future, but we're probably at least 10 years out on those. Tesla factories are the most energy efficient out there and they plan to use almost entirely renewable energy for their new battery manufacturing. And Teslas battery farms could easily solve Texas power issues. Texas has very few power issues. |
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Post by Ronv69 on Sept 15, 2022 11:47:43 GMT -5
EVs are neither popular nor practical out here. Distances are too long. I don’t know of a single one in the area. We see a Tesla about twice a year, just passing through. You have to plan ahead to drive an electric car in Texas. The new Maverick hybrid is getting to be a common sight though. |
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Post by Ronv69 on Sept 15, 2022 11:50:55 GMT -5
It's not even the generation of the energy. The manufacturing of the batteries accounts for most of the carbon footprint. On top of that they aren't going to last long enough to break even. 100k and they will need new batteries, putting them further behind. Most mining experts say there isn't enough lithium to build all the batteries. Refining the lithium is a filthy business too. I'm bummed that Musk is going to build a lithium processing plant in a formerly beautiful part of Texas. Hydrogen/electric cars are the future, but we're probably at least 10 years out on those. Tesla factories are the most energy efficient out there and they plan to use almost entirely renewable energy for their new battery manufacturing. And Teslas battery farms could easily solve Texas power issues. Have you ever driven through an area that has been mined or used for processing ore? Parts of Colorado are going to be toxic for the next 500 years. |
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Post by Ronv69 on Sept 15, 2022 11:59:34 GMT -5
Once again, where do you think we would be without the energy companies? Frankly, I didn't say get rid of energy companies, I said I didn't like them. A necessary evil as they demonstrate little concern over the impact of cost increases. Particularly since they are probably the most heavily subsidized industry in the country. I believe that if we're pouring money into them, they should be paying it back to the feds. Otherwise they're just on the dole. I can understand why it looks like that from the outside, but I see huge buildings that are abandoned that were oilfield service companies that employed hundreds of people all over Texas and Louisiana. Thousands of small and large businesses that worked in the support of the oil industry have gone under which makes ramping up oil production very difficult and more expensive than it needs to be. If the government would get out of the way, you could have gasoline for a dollar a gallon, plus tax. |
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Post by sperrytops on Sept 15, 2022 12:32:01 GMT -5
EVs are neither popular nor practical out here. Distances are too long. I don’t know of a single one in the area. We see a Tesla about twice a year, just passing through. You have to plan ahead to drive an electric car in Texas. The new Maverick hybrid is getting to be a common sight though. I'm guessing you'll see a few more in Austin over the next few years. |
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Post by sperrytops on Sept 15, 2022 12:35:11 GMT -5
Tesla factories are the most energy efficient out there and they plan to use almost entirely renewable energy for their new battery manufacturing. And Teslas battery farms could easily solve Texas power issues. Have you ever driven through an area that has been mined or used for processing ore? Parts of Colorado are going to be toxic for the next 500 years. Any kind of oil or mineral extraction has the same result. |
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Post by Ronv69 on Sept 15, 2022 15:46:25 GMT -5
Have you ever driven through an area that has been mined or used for processing ore? Parts of Colorado are going to be toxic for the next 500 years. Any kind of oil or mineral extraction has the same result. Yep. |
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Post by Ronv69 on Sept 15, 2022 15:52:22 GMT -5
We see a Tesla about twice a year, just passing through. You have to plan ahead to drive an electric car in Texas. The new Maverick hybrid is getting to be a common sight though. I'm guessing you'll see a few more in Austin over the next few years. Not likely as we won't be going to Austin. Crime is getting out of control and everything is really expensive. But it is the best place for them. I saw a lot when I was working in the Woodlands, north of Houston, along with the Jaguars and Masaratis. Do you have an electric car yet? I don't know anyone who owns one. I'm not against them, but I don't think that we can or should make a sudden transition without preparing the grid, (nuclear), and other infrastructure. The hydrogen is more likely to be long term solution. |
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Post by sperrytops on Sept 15, 2022 17:34:45 GMT -5
I'm guessing you'll see a few more in Austin over the next few years. Not likely as we won't be going to Austin. Crime is getting out of control and everything is really expensive. But it is the best place for them. I saw a lot when I was working in the Woodlands, north of Houston, along with the Jaguars and Masaratis. Do you have an electric car yet? I don't know anyone who owns one. I'm not against them, but I don't think that we can or should make a sudden transition without preparing the grid, (nuclear), and other infrastructure. The hydrogen is more likely to be long term solution. I must admit, I drive a Tesla. |
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Post by Plainsman on Sept 15, 2022 17:51:31 GMT -5
NOW he tells us!  |
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Post by sperrytops on Sept 15, 2022 17:52:03 GMT -5
I'm guessing you'll see a few more in Austin over the next few years. Not likely as we won't be going to Austin. Crime is getting out of control and everything is really expensive. But it is the best place for them. I saw a lot when I was working in the Woodlands, north of Houston, along with the Jaguars and Masaratis. Do you have an electric car yet? I don't know anyone who owns one. I'm not against them, but I don't think that we can or should make a sudden transition without preparing the grid, (nuclear), and other infrastructure. The hydrogen is more likely to be long term solution. Hydrogen would certainly seem to be a cleaner solution. But progress is always incremental. |
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Post by sperrytops on Sept 15, 2022 17:54:46 GMT -5
NOW he tells us! You caught me out! |
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Post by Ronv69 on Sept 15, 2022 17:56:59 GMT -5
Not likely as we won't be going to Austin. Crime is getting out of control and everything is really expensive. But it is the best place for them. I saw a lot when I was working in the Woodlands, north of Houston, along with the Jaguars and Masaratis. Do you have an electric car yet? I don't know anyone who owns one. I'm not against them, but I don't think that we can or should make a sudden transition without preparing the grid, (nuclear), and other infrastructure. The hydrogen is more likely to be long term solution. I must admit, I drive a Tesla. Great! What's your experience? Have you had to have it serviced or repaired? How often do you drive it and how far? What's your longest trip? Sorry, but inquiring minds want to know! 😁 It's not like I wouldn't want one in theory, but I couldn't afford half of one with enough range and the ones I could afford, I wouldn't drive. I looked really hard at leasing a Volt when I was driving 90 miles round trip to work, but I got a Cobalt and with gas at $2.25 it paid for itself in 4 years. |
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Post by Ronv69 on Sept 15, 2022 18:00:19 GMT -5
Not likely as we won't be going to Austin. Crime is getting out of control and everything is really expensive. But it is the best place for them. I saw a lot when I was working in the Woodlands, north of Houston, along with the Jaguars and Masaratis. Do you have an electric car yet? I don't know anyone who owns one. I'm not against them, but I don't think that we can or should make a sudden transition without preparing the grid, (nuclear), and other infrastructure. The hydrogen is more likely to be long term solution. Hydrogen would certainly seem to be a cleaner solution. But progress is always incremental. I think that full plug in electric is a slight detour from where we're going to end up. Maybe a hydrogen/battery hybrid, but I really appreciate the current PEV owners for doing the work to get the bugs out of the technology before I have to buy one. 😁😉 |
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Post by sperrytops on Sept 15, 2022 18:18:39 GMT -5
I must admit, I drive a Tesla. Great! What's your experience? Have you had to have it serviced or repaired? How often do you drive it and how far? What's your longest trip? Sorry, but inquiring minds want to know! 😁 It's not like I wouldn't want one in theory, but I couldn't afford half of one with enough range and the ones I could afford, I wouldn't drive. I looked really hard at leasing a Volt when I was driving 90 miles round trip to work, but I got a Cobalt and with gas at $2.25 it paid for itself in 4 years. I love it. I’ve had it now for about a year and a half. Never serviced or repaired. It actually has 40% fewer parts than a gas engine car. Range on my battery is about 320 miles giveor take depending on road conditions. The new models are at about 380. Wife and I drive it every day but we generally don’t go long distances. You can charge it in a 110, 220 or super charge outlet. I use 110 just cause we don’t go that far. MY son has one as well (he actually talked me into one) and charges in his 220 outlet. He’s gone long distances. He can do a full charge overnight. At 110 it takes me around 14-16 hours. Supercharge stations can charge really fast but I don’t have a need for it. Computer monitors monitor performance if all components and tells you if you have a failure somewhere. Never happened to me. Otherwise no service required. A friend of my sons has one and he’s travelled coast to coast. Never had issues or problems finding a supercharge station. The onboard computer will map your trip and tell you where to stop to charge. I also have an old Silverado pickup and if I have the money when the Cybertruck comes out I may jump on one of those, if I have the money. interesting factoid is the only fluid used in the vehicle is windshield washer fluid. No brake pads as it uses modulation of the electric drive motors for braking. All in all I’m quite happy with it. |
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Post by Ronv69 on Sept 15, 2022 18:28:06 GMT -5
Great! What's your experience? Have you had to have it serviced or repaired? How often do you drive it and how far? What's your longest trip? Sorry, but inquiring minds want to know! 😁 It's not like I wouldn't want one in theory, but I couldn't afford half of one with enough range and the ones I could afford, I wouldn't drive. I looked really hard at leasing a Volt when I was driving 90 miles round trip to work, but I got a Cobalt and with gas at $2.25 it paid for itself in 4 years. I love it. I’ve had it now for about a year and a half. Never serviced or repaired. It actually has 40% fewer parts than a gas engine car. Range on my battery is about 320 miles giveor take depending on road conditions. The new models are at about 380. Wife and I drive it every day but we generally don’t go long distances. You can charge it in a 110, 220 or super charge outlet. I use 110 just cause we don’t go that far. MY son has one as well (he actually talked me into one) and charges in his 220 outlet. He’s gone long distances. He can do a full charge overnight. At 110 it takes me around 14-16 hours. Supercharge stations can charge really fast but I don’t have a need for it. Computer monitors monitor performance if all components and tells you if you have a failure somewhere. Never happened to me. Otherwise no service required. A friend of my sons has one and he’s travelled coast to coast. Never had issues or problems finding a supercharge station. The onboard computer will map your trip and tell you where to stop to charge. I also have an old Silverado pickup and if I have the money when the Cybertruck comes out I may jump on one of those, if I have the money. interesting factoid is the only fluid used in the vehicle is windshield washer fluid. No brake pads as it uses modulation of the electric drive motors for braking. All in all I’m quite happy with it. 👍 👍 |
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Post by toshtego on Sept 15, 2022 19:41:20 GMT -5
Nothing I can afford. Our winters are such a vehicle which produces HEAT is good to have. I cannot see placing a wood burning stove in the back seat of an EV.
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Post by urbino on Sept 15, 2022 20:01:11 GMT -5
Back in the early '90s -- like '91 or '92 -- there was a tv movie called The Water Engine, about a poor, no-name inventor who comes up with an engine that runs on water. TNT (or possibly TBS) made it and I think 3 other movies as kind of an early experiment in content creation. One of them was a biopic about Alexander Graham Bell. Anyway, this guy, played by some nerdy-looking actor named William H. Macy, invents the engine, and then gets screwed out of it by Big Combustion, who immediately deep-six it, never to see the light of day again.
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